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Yu Yu Hakusho Speed

Discussion in 'Meta Battledome' started by Zaelapolopollo, Sep 21, 2009.

  1. Zaelapolopollo Master of the Fates of Arda

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    Ya know apart from the Hiei speedblitzing the dude who can throw a hundred punches a second thing that is brought up in nearly all YYH topcs, I can't remember any real great speed feats for the characters.I'm probably just forgetting them so does anyone have any notable ones?

    And in terms of speed, is YYH around Bleach/One Piece level or beyond?
     
  2. Omnirix Magician's Red

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    Well I don't know if this is one but post DT Yusuke apparently can ride a bicycle faster than a race car.
     
  3. Lord Raizen The Warrior God

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    As far as can remember, you really dont have many quantifiable speed feats. You really just have to speed scale, which is made easier by the class system. You have D/C class Hiei completely owning Seiryu, then you have low B class Yusuke tieing with Hiei in the Dark Tournament. Hiei was B class at that point as well. However there was the instant when B class Hiei easily outran a gas explosion. Which i've heard range from 2000-8000 m/s.
     
  4. migukuni The Romantic Warrior; Taurus

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    YYH speed should be higher than bleach/OP levels

    in the manga we haven't exactly seen S level speeds and strengths the levels of mukuro and Yomi. We only see it in the anime

    In the anime though, S levels like yomi and mukuro are like 5x-10x faster than wind: which is ginda

    I don't know how fast wind is...
     
  5. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    "10 x faster than the wind" - That doesn't sound that impressive. Even with an F5 tornado standing in for "the wind", that would only amount to around 1340m/s
     
  6. Cableguy15 Retired

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    Hiei has the majority of YYH's speed feats.

    There's the feat where he saves yusuke from a gas explosion just as it had detonated. It's easily hypersonic because the detonation velocity of a gas explosion is 1,500-2,000 m/s

    There's also the one where he's standing about 20 feet away from makintaro, and manages to slice off his arm, but did it so fast it didn't even look like he had moved to Makintaro. Calced at mach 2-9. Toguro in his base form also has a similar feat to this, except he was closer.

    Seiryu was put at a speed of around mach 1-2 for what he did.

    And Hiei cutting down Seiryu was calced at mach 16.

    There was also a calculation that put Toguro's thumb flicking speed at 5,000 km/s for him to create the air bullets. :LOS

    From there it's all speed scaling.
     
  7. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    Do you have a link to this? I wanna see how they worked that out.
     
  8. NemeBro I is unicorn

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    I am pretty sure Yusuke and Kuwabara were bullet-timing after the Saint Beasts arc.
     
  9. Ultimate Deathsaurer Nightmare of Zi

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    Ryoma was dicking around with it about a month ago. He wasn't taking is seriously though.
     
  10. Herekic Deal with it

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    The biggest I'd say is hiei outrunning a gas explosion while carrying somebody.

    and he was only a B class at the time, which is a down right weakling by end of series levels.
     
  11. Shock Therapy Divine Power Monochrome

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    for higher levels everything is about power scaling as feats are limited for S class and above
     
  12. Zaelapolopollo Master of the Fates of Arda

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    When did Hiei ourun this gas explosion?
     
  13. Akatora Active Member

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    Likely in the city right, if so the car got speed restrictions...

    Or was this him cycling on while it was just accelerating from a green light?

    Or did he pass it on the highway at it's max speed :p
     
  14. Gnome It's Me You'll Fight

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    air from Toguro's thumb bullet things would have to go pretty fast to blow the heads off of demons who are probably more durable than humans.
     
  15. Yohan Kokuchouin Child of the Lost Time

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    They are labeled as Hypersonic plus. Pretty much sums up their speed. However, they haven't shown any reason why they should be at or above lightning dodging or reactions...

    Some tried to argue Suzaku, but it clearly wasn't lightning.

    Although YYH lacks speed, normally their opponents don't have what it takes to put them down
     
  16. God Movement Admanistrator

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    X
    X
    X
    X
    X - Hiei and Yusuke were fighting evenly right after.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2009
  17. Cableguy15 Retired

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    Yeah, Kamen Rider Ryoma did it (Actually, he's pretty much done most of the YYH calcs): X

    I also remembered wrong, it's more like 3,000 km/s. 5,000 was the speed of the punches :LOS
     
  18. migukuni The Romantic Warrior; Taurus

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    well, in the anime the guy that fought against ginda was saying he can be as fast as the light (i just watched the scene again). and ginda at that time was an S-class that could defeat 3-4 yusuke's in sensui arc, hmmm... its very complicated i see (although all of this are in the anime not the manga)
     
  19. Zaelapolopollo Master of the Fates of Arda

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    SpiritGun, you got a link to any of the actual calcs like the one saying Hiei was Mach 16?
     
  20. Yohan Kokuchouin Child of the Lost Time

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    So let me get this straight, the best speed feat they have is Mach 16? Is YYH that far behind in terms of speed?
    I know YYH must have some speed that's higher than this.
     
  21. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    Far behind the HST?

    I asked for One Piece calcs and the only reliable ones were approaching 1000m/s, anything higher being based on douriki scaling linearly and so on.

    Don't know about Bleach, but I don't think it was determined definitively compared to One Piece.

    Naruto doesn't have calcs that high.


    Isn't Mach 16 ahead of all the HST, then?
     
  22. Zaelapolopollo Master of the Fates of Arda

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    That's what I was thinking. I always figured Bleach and One Piece were low hypersonic so Mach 16 should be at or above them.
     
  23. Monzaemon Active Member

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    Wtf? How is mach 16 "that far behind"?

    I don't think there are any feasible "calculations" to support anyone from HST is past that level of speed.
     
  24. Yohan Kokuchouin Child of the Lost Time

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    Hey Hey, no offense now lol.
    Is that speed higher than the Big 6? Where would it stand with Dragonball?
     
  25. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    Somewhere during or after Goku defeated Tao probably.
     
  26. Shoddragon Active Member

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    are you kidding me? a simple calc can easily yield gear 2 luffy being over 10,000 m/s assuming bare minimums.
     
  27. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    Reveal this simple calc, please. I'll grant that that's potentially possible, but I haven't seen any evidence of it.
     
  28. Shoddragon Active Member

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    ok. in order to disappear from sight, a human needs to be moving at 89 m/s. a peak human's max speed is only around 8.9 m/s. so there is a good distance of areound 10 times from someone's max speed and how much it takes to disappear from sight of them. zoro did this without even leaving a trace of himself, so a bare minimum assumption of 100 meters per second. Blueno disappeared from luffy's sight, meaning he was moving at around 1,000 m/s. Luffy in gear 2 blitzed blueno so much he disappeared. so gear 2 luffy was moving at a bare bones minimum of 10,000 meters per second. not very difficult and its using the fact that 89 meters per second is around the speed it takes to disappear from someone's sight.

    douriki calculations assume that 40 times higher douriki for example means being able to move that much faster. those calcs were done using douriki and reaction speed. seeing as I have know knowledge of reaction speed and movement speed and how exactly they interact I wouldn't dare try something like that.
     
  29. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    No, it could be just twice their speed or fifty. It depends on the particular characters attributes for a start, and furthermore, there is no set speed such as 89m/s that will make something imperceptible. There are increments of time which will make things imperceptible, but bodily speed to travel about in battle obviously involves a distance component, which makes things very variable.
     
  30. Shoddragon Active Member

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    I said it was a basic, simple calculation. not a super detailed "factor this, factor that" things in it. its just a baseline for his speed.

    its generally accepted that 89 m/s or around 200 mph is the required speed for a human to disappear from sight of another human. that is a 10 times speed gap from peak human speed of around 8.9 m/s or around 20 mph.

    BTW: The more variables, the higher the chance of error and the higher the chance of MORE errors. I just kept it simple.
     
  31. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    It's not the complexity I have issue with. It's just that there is no set speed for disappearing from sight, and the fact that the figure cited is ten times higher than the cited human speed is a correlating relationship, not a causal one (except in the sense that you need to think/see fast enough to control your movements). This means Luffy's "can't see" speed could be anything above his own speed, not ten.

    One thing that's more stable is the max duration of things people can detect. The threshold for this is around 1-5 miliseconds. A phenomena called summing localization can demonstrate this with sound, in which soundwaves arriving in an interval below this level will be perceived as one sound. This is the limitation of the brain's perception of time, and it works on a visual level as well (it's consistent with airforce tests).

    So, to be completely imperceptible, a movement should be <200th of a second. The disappearing from vision feat can be accomplished by crossing the field of vision in that time. There's no real set speed for this like the cited 89m/s; it's dependent on the time perception threshold and distance combined.

    Using Soru in front of a human who's concentrating on you and jumping three meters through their field of vision and looking like you disappeared would be >600m/s. You can say that this will be variable due to surprise and concentration, but if it's consistently being done, then this becomes much less important. So, there's a minimum for CP9 arc stuff for a start...

    Still it doesn't help pin down how great their speed really is, cause it can be very much greater over that minimum.


    Spoiler:
    Did this thread just get hijacked into a One Piece speed thread?
     
  32. Lord Raizen The Warrior God

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    As far as concrete information on speed goes YYH>HST, but its generally assumed that many of the HST are much faster than what the we get form the few calculations that are able to be formed. But this is also the case with YYH, and the Mach 16 feat of Hiei's was done when he was still a C class demon. Guys like Toguro and DT Yusuke should be significantly above this. And then you have Sensui casually taking on A class Hiei, Kuabara, and Kurama. And from there you have the massive gaps between Sensui and even the weakest of S class demons.
     
  33. Cableguy15 Retired

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    Yeah...

    Seiryu - X

    Hiei - X

    You need to see Seiryu's to understand the Hiei one. Surprisingly it's an everyday math problem.

    Also, the 3,000 km/s and 5,000 km/s are real calculations, just wildly inconsistent.
     
  34. Monzaemon Active Member

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    I guess by that logic the Raikage from Naruto is massively hypersonic, too. After all, Sasuke was disappearing from sight to super-humans, but couldn't follow the Raikage with his eyes.

    And I've no idea how you came up with 10,000 m/s. It was even established later in the series that Blueno was perceptible to Luffy that day.
     
  35. migukuni The Romantic Warrior; Taurus

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    and they were only B class at this point

    S class should be around light speed if we go by powerscaling
     
  36. Yohan Kokuchouin Child of the Lost Time

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    No they shouldn't... They should be hypersonic.

    C Class Hiei was hypersonic, Toguro was stronger and faster than him, but not by a massive margin. The same case for Sensui. Then higher up... No one on their gets blitzed or massively blitzed through a massive diffence in speed unless they are really low level characters.
     
  37. migukuni The Romantic Warrior; Taurus

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    YYH is then
    durability and power rather than speed
     
  38. Shoddragon Active Member

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    I only considered combat speed of YYH to be a lot faster than bleach but around the same or a little bit less than luffy using jet gatling gun. based on the fact in the manga when he saw unreleased yusuke beating the crap out of 80% toguro there were like hundreds of punches. no bleach character has ever had such attack speed at such a distance, even starkk's thousand cero gun.

    luffy does things like that all the time.the only definite thing YYH has over bleach and naruto so far without any qualms would be power. I mean mountain busting and stuff. REAL mountain busting. not like inuyasha mountain busting where character A destroys a big rock and then people call it a mountain. the reason its not so definite above one piece is because of whitebeard's possible life wiping/ planet busting. and I do mean POSSIBLE not at all guaranteed.

    Durability is something YYH I would think again has over bleach and naruto but not definitely one piece. look at what zoro took. he didn't tank super huge large city destroying attacks, but he took DIRECT pain and fatigue. and survived.
     
  39. Yohan Kokuchouin Child of the Lost Time

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    Why are we ranking YYH so low as to HST standards?
    Why not Big 6 standards?
    There's also Samurai Deeper Kyo, Negima, Dragonball (up to 23rd Budokai)... We should be looking at their speeds and then trying to figure out where YYH stops.
     
  40. Zaelapolopollo Master of the Fates of Arda

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    Kay. Thanks.
     
  41. Cableguy15 Retired

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    Oh hell naw. Zoro survived a lot of damage, that's all. A-class Hiei, Kurama, and Kuwabara survived an S-class, who can shred up plateaus and mountains by fighting near them. Yusuke can shrug those same attacks off as an S-class. Zoro has nowhere near their durability.

    Maze Castle Hiei would actually be a joke in comparison to many of the Dark tournament's competitors, especially anyone in the finals... So there's a ton of speed scaling to be done.

    If only there were a way to calcuslate the gas explosion feat, we could get an accurate estimate for B-class characters...
     
  42. Fang Titan

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    Ryoma had a calc of Toguro's finger bullets moving around over 1800kms a second or something similar to that. Speaking of which didn't that Genyosai guy also have one for Freeza's death beams moving at mach 5164 or something?
     
  43. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    Yes, but it's still rudimentary and based off earlier reaction times, rather than their reaction times up to that point, so it could be several times faster than that even.


    I can apply the method for Soru if I can know how far away Lucci was when he was being hit into through the wall.

    With that, it may well be over 6000m/s+, but it depends on the distance.
     
  44. Crimson Dragoon King of the Seven Seas

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    I think the air bullet thing was around 3000m/s

    Not sure how seriously you should take that though
     
  45. Fang Titan

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    Didn't an armed Marine officer have a gun and his Douriki was measured at ten or something?
     
  46. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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  47. Cableguy15 Retired

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    I have to wonder if it was just taking melee attacks into consideration. I mean meauring the strength of a bullet, when it's considered impressive for Franky to tank them seems a bit out there.
     
  48. Genyosai 10,000 Year Old Cod

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    Well, you can measure the power a gun can produce, so it makes sense in that way.
     

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