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The Viz "Clear Up" Thread

Discussion in 'Konoha Library' started by Cyphon, Mar 7, 2011.

  1. Reddan Active Member

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    Sorry my fault. I put the question in the wrong place. It only has ......

    Though I repeat this was not translated by Mari Morimoto and Naruto was no where near as popular then.
     
  2. BlinkST Never too l8 for Rinne h8

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    Spoiler:
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    Spoiler:
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    Spoiler:
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    Well phew. Glad they didn't fuck that one up. Vol 54 was pretty good.
     
  3. Jizznificent Your unborn bro

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    i like the way they were worded, especially the second page (with the light and shadow powers speech). i am also glad that they got the "practical application" part correct.

    btw can you also show the last page where tobi talks about nagato, blinx?
     
  4. Mister Banned

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    I second this.

    It would be interesting if Nagato was deemed to be the Third Sage of Six Paths. Simply because Tobi is considered to be one for having Uchiha and Senju blood/abilities. Would this imply Nagato has/had (latent?) Uchiha and Senju powers?
     
  5. BlinkST Never too l8 for Rinne h8

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    Either they're waking up, or they're looking at ShounenSuki's talk page and/ our spoiler thread :blinditachi


    EDIT: So it basically sounds like Izanagi "came" from the Sage, but it's not something he actually used, and "Izanagi" can also be considered a philosophy of some kind? :geg


    Spoiler:
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    There you go. Didn't fuck that one up either.
     
  6. Mister Banned

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    The impression I got was that Izanagi was a practical application of the first Sage of the Six Path's jutsu.
    Though didn't the fan translation also suggest this? :hmm
     
  7. SageEnergyMode Active Member

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    That Izanagi viz translation is absolutely flawless.

    Love the light style power and shadow style power classification.
     
  8. BlinkST Never too l8 for Rinne h8

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    Well the Sage had an ability; it's not called a jutsu. And Viz kept it the same. The confusing part is what Tobi says in the last panel of the second picture, and first panel of the third picture.
     
  9. Thdyingbreed Rampaging Beast

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    This page please, specifically the parts about Susanoo.

    X
     
  10. july_winter Retired

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    Ch 466, Vol 50 page 47. Lowest panels -

    Sasuke: All my cells hurt... So this is the Susanoo's side effect... If you use it continuously... So much pain, and I haven't even achieved complete possession form yet... How bad was it for Itachi...?


    EDIT: Oh wait, would you be needing a scan? I cannot provide it...
     
  11. BlinkST Never too l8 for Rinne h8

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    Spoiler:
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    There we go.
     
  12. Faustus Immortal

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    Well, I didn't like it at all. This part is confusing as hell. Why not use traditional "Yin" and "Yang" (with "release", if necessary)? Translating them into the "shadow" and "light" is plain stupid, because this concept is much bigger than just that.

    Also, their wording is difficult to read as usual. I would hardly understand the meaning if I wasn't reading the fan translations.
     
  13. BlinkST Never too l8 for Rinne h8

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    Well that's the thing. You spoiled yourself with fan translations. You wouldn't care if you never read them to begin with, but you did..
     
  14. Senjuclan Mori No Senju Ichizoku

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    In all fairness Faustus has a point. When I read yin and yang, I can appreciate the philosophical underpinning of the story. I can understand that the author is trying to convey the duality of a Rikudou powers, yin and yang, Senju and Uchiha. Light and Darkness is too vague and removed from what the author said in Japanese.
     
  15. BlinkST Never too l8 for Rinne h8

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    ..."Light" and "Shadow" are "too vague" in that context?
     
  16. takL unfit 4

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    Viz might be a bit underestimating Naruto fans of the world. like kids would never get the yin n yang thing.
     
  17. BlinkST Never too l8 for Rinne h8

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    It's not really that they are underestimating fans. They always change the names of element names to "<Element> Style". Besides, Light and Shadow can still fit in leu "Yin" and "Yang".
     
  18. SageEnergyMode Active Member

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    Viz is translating more to the specific meaning of the manga and how each of the various things are used.

    You have your wind style, fire style, earth style, lightning style, and water style chakra natures along with your wood style, lava style, blast style, magnet style etc. Then Shikamaru's jutsu, Genjutsu, Chouji's jutsu and Medical Ninjutsu all fall into the light style and shadow style categories of nature manipulation.

    Viz's translation isn't just smart, it's consistent. I'm also blown away that some would say that the wording of Viz's translation is difficult to read... Their translations, if read correctly, clear up any and all confusion that some people may have. Their translations, for example, when read carefully, tell readers that Iruka when he spoke about the Third Hokage's strength was not making a direct comparison to the Fourth Hokage, but was relaying information in a past tense that only compared Hiruzen to Hashirama and Tobirama at the time the Third earned the nickname "The Professor". It's the same exact reason why Hiruzen himself got angry at Iruka for speaking in the past tense. The implication of Iruka's comments were that the Third was no longer that same legendary shinobi that he once was.
     
  19. Reddan Active Member

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    Brilliant post and I completely agree with it especially about Hiruzen. The statements about him being the strongest were clearly in the past.

    The VIZ also do a similar thing the praise Sandaime Kazekage gets. They say he was only stronger than his predecessors. Hence, implying the later Kazekages, surpassed him like is a big theme of Kishimoto's manga.
     
  20. Mister Banned

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    I don't see a problem with 'light' and 'shadow'; for the philosophical basis, the reader has the clear image of the Yin-Yang symbol on the page if they wish to go that deep.
    If that doesn't make you happy, you clearly see 'Inton' and 'Yoton' on the panels too; stick with those if 'light' and 'shadow' don't meet your fancy?

    Also, does this mean there is no 'Yin-Yang' style jutsu going by Viz? :hmm

    Oh I see. Well, personally, I gathered it meant that Tobi called Izanagi a jutsu which can turn illusion into reality; akin to the Sage's ability.
    I doubt he'd need to explain its main mechanism - the ultimate jutsu to cast on oneself - as he did so before imo.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2012
  21. takL unfit 4

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    whatever, i cant wait to see how they are translating bees "i originally thought it was her well-used dark nipp..." line hehe!
     
  22. Turrin 玄武

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    Viz releases the highest quality English scans of Naruto you can read. What I mean by this is that Viz scans have thee best picture quality and translation. With that said I'm not saying Viz can't make translation mistakes here and there, but the mistakes in Viz translation are incredibly rare, while if you look at Online scans there is practically a mistake in translation every other chapter, but one has to remember that Viz is translated by professionals who are paid to spend hours making the translation fit perfectly in English. So if you want to read the best quality scans of the manga than you should read Viz & I very much doubt anyone who reads Viz will come out of it understanding the manga less than when reading Online scans.

    With that out of the way, I just got the Viz Translated DB III & Volume 54. If anyone has any questions feel free to post them or PM me. I might post some of the differences I found interesting once I get a chance to read both in detail.
     
  23. Reddan Active Member

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    I've been a bit lazy buying up the volumes and have yet to get Volume 53 or 54. However, I am more interested in the databook. If you have time can you post the beginning of the Orochimaru page. Especially the line Hiruzen says to him about not being able to compete with such talent.

    Also the section on Susano'o about Amaterasu and Tsukiyomi. Especially now that we have the VIZ translation of Madara's words.
     
  24. Ukoku .

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    "Well used?" Just what are you trying to say, Bee? :laugh
     
  25. Thdyingbreed Rampaging Beast

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    These two pages please.

    Also is anyone going to be getting Shonen jump alpha when it comes out? Would be great to have all the translations up to the newest one.

    X
    X
     
  26. july_winter Retired

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    Ch 486, Vol 52 page 54

    Naruto: ... We die.

    Sakura: !?

    Kakashi: ...!

    Zetsu: ...?

    Tobi: ...

    Ch 486, Vol 52 page 55

    Naruto: If you invade Konoha... I will fight you... Until that day, you need to keep your hate in check... And throw it all at me then. I'm the only one who can handle all the hate! Only I can fulfill that duty! I bear the burden of your hate, and I'll die with you!

    Sasuke: ... What is it with you? What do you want?! Why do you keep messing in my business?!

    Naruto: ...
     
  27. Mister Banned

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    By any chance would Viz's databook have the information of the previous databooks too?
     
  28. Turrin 玄武

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    No just DB III
     
  29. Mister Banned

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    :(

    Thanks for replying though.
    By the way, is there anything about Nagato/Pain/Rinnegan's entry about the elemental mastery? Does it list five or six natures?

    Also does the Rikudou Sennin's entry - the part about the Rinnegan towering supreme over Doujutsu - match the fan translated version?

    Does it also mention Minato's affinity for creating jutsu as it does in the fan translated version?

    Lastly, does it mention anything about Sasuke's (databook) scores improving with him obtaining the MS? (I remember reading it around on the boards, but I can't find it anywhere.)


    Sorry about the hefty amount of requests. :p
    Take your time, though! :awesome
     
  30. Turrin 玄武

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    "the "Professor" of the group, the Third Hokage said of him, "All of my knowledge is still no match for his talent."

    So basically Hiruzen is just saying that Orochimaru's Genius/Talent is > than his Wisdom/Knowledge. It doesn't have to do with overall Ninja ability. Like I have said before Prime Hiruzen > Old Hiruzen ~ Orochimaru.

    "Amaterasu representing the light of the material world; and Tsukuyomi, the nightmare realm, representing the world of the of the mind and darkness."

    So the main change here is that the Viz says Amaterasu represents the light of the material world, while the Online translations says Amaterasu represents light and the material world. & The Viz says Tsukuyomi represents Mind and darkness, while the online translations says it represents the spiritual world and darkness.

    Overall the viz sounds more to me like Kishi is not talking about Yin/Yang here, but just that one is a physical attack while the other is a mental attack


    @Everyone

    Aside from that I'll say that the online translation are missing a few jutsu and are also missing a few entries from DB III. One of the most interesting entries I was the one given to the Toad Sage who predicted J-man's & Naruto's future, because it states that he is thousands of years old & it states that the reason he can see the future is due to his enormous amounts of chakra. Now considering that Naruto, B, Nagato, etc... have never had any premonitions of the future, it seems like the Toad Sage has the greatest amount of chakra in existence with the possible exception being Rikudo or the Juubi.

    Given this fact and the age of the Toad Sage, I'm starting to believe that the Toad Sage was originally Rikudo Sannin's Summon & Rikudo Sannin was the first to sign a contract with the Toads. It also makes me wonder just how powerful J-man & Minato really were, considering as experienced Toad summoners, there is a good chance they may have had the ability to summon the Toad Sage, which apparently is more powerful than the Demon Fox, so yeah... if J-man could summon the Toad Sage that could easily explain why Itachi was so afraid of fighting him or if Minato could summon the Toad Sage that could easily explain all the statements about him being this unsurpassable GoaT.

    1. Says Five Chakra Natures
    2. For Rikudo's Entry on Rannigan it says, "the highest form of occular ninjutsu, Rinnegan eye." Which kind of makes me wonder if Rannigan = ultimate Ninjutsu dojutsu, EMS = ultimate Genjutsu dojutsu, & Byakugan = ultimate Taijutsu dojutsu. If you have all three you basically have access to the strongest techniques in existence.
    3. "With the talent to invent many jutsu in his own style." So yeah it does & in-fact suggest he invented many different jutsu, which pretty much means that Minato has not even begun to show us all of his Jutsu since the only two Jutsu we have seen from him which he invented were Rasengan & FTG, which I do not think qualifies as being many jutsu.
    4. "Now that he's awakened his Mangekyo Sharingan his numbers are bound to grow even more." I think this means that his Genjutsu proficiency will increase because MS, well, increases his Genjutsu proficiency
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2012
  31. SageEnergyMode Active Member

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    Well, that's super interesting like whoa. However, perhaps the Toad Sage can see the future because of not only its enormous amounts of chakra, but also due to its enormous and unmatched mastery of Natural Energy?

    That could also be a factor in its ability to see the future as well, which could possibly open the floodgate for Naruto to somehow gain a similar ability if he ever does manage to augment the power of the Kyuubi with Sennin Mode.

    Sick, love that line about Minato's ability to invent many jutsu.
     
  32. Turrin 玄武

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    That is a good theory and all, but the Data-book just outright says it's due to his enormous amounts of chakra, not due to natural energy or anything like that. So the data-book clearly suggests that the Sage Toad has the greatest amount of chakra of any current living entity in the naruto world. Combine that with the fact that he's had thousands of years to master jutsu and probably has mastered SM & he's easily in the running for strongest entity in existence.

    Naruto may gain the ability just due to gaining enormous amounts of chakra, I mean once he tames the kyuubi and can use all of it's chakra + his own + Sage mode in essence increasing that amount of chakra by 1/3 he should be up there as well.

    But my thought is that Gammabunta showed the ability to transfer his chakra to Naruto in part I, I assume the sage toad has the same ability, so perhaps Naruto will learn to summon him in the final battle and he'll transfer his chakra to Naruto which will allow him to rival Juubi in raw chakra amounts.
     
  33. Reddan Active Member

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    Thanks for the translation, but I have to disagree with you on what it means. To me it Hiruzen is admitting that Orochimaru has greater potential than he does. Anyway not the place to argue.
    Again I will disagree with that interpretation, but I think we should compare it to what Tobi said.

    Inton SHADOW style power, founded upon MENTAL energies that govern the imagination.

    Tsukiyomi, the nightmare realm representing the world of the MIND and DARKNESS


    Yoton, LIGHT style power, founded upon the PHYSICAL energies that govern life.

    Amaterasu representing the LIGHT of the MATERIAL world.


    This plus many others makes me even more confident that Amaterasu is Yoton and Tsukiomi is Inton.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2012
  34. Thdyingbreed Rampaging Beast

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    Turrin you have volume 54? I'd like to see what the VIZ translation says for these pages.

    X
    X
    X
    X
     
  35. SageEnergyMode Active Member

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    Here goes your answer for the last three pages, but someone would have to post the first one for you.
     
  36. SageEnergyMode Active Member

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    Hey, Turrin if possible please write out the jutsu that weren't in the fan translations. Is Itachi's Genjutsu that he used on Naruto at the start of part one there?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2012
  37. Turrin 玄武

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    It says pretty much the same thing as the good online translations
    Actually I think the Online translations have all the Jutsu, I got confused by the English and Japanese names and thought they didn't have all the jutsu at first, but i'll check some more when I get a chance to make sure they do. As for Itachi's Genjutsu it's not in there ether, which makes me wonder where people got the name for this jutsu from.

    @Everyone

    Okay another interesting thing is that DB III has a dictionary of terms, which has never been translated online. Most of the stuff is ether redundant or not all that interesting [Though some things are a bit funny]. However the one thing I did find interesting is that the dictionary explains teleportation Ninjutsu and not Shunshin, but true teleportation as in Minato's FTG and Tobi's S/T Jutsu. Here's the entry:

    "High level Ninjutsu that surpasses the concepts of space and distance. It allows one to move into a subspace and appear at a specific destination with a Jutsu formula"

    What I find interesting about this is the fact that it says a person moves into Sub Space when they use Teleportation Ninjutsu. Most likely Sub Space is Box Dimension. Which means Tobi's S/T Jutsu would have never worked against Minato and Tobi was totally F'd against Minato no matter what he tried to do. It also means 1 of 3 things, ether

    A) Minato is traveling accross subspace at such high speeds he's unable to interact with it, which means he does gain great momentum when using FTG, which means his FTG attacks are far more devstatingly powerful than people are giving him credit for

    B) Minato just moves into subspace when he uses FTG and like Tobi can interact with it until he chooses to leave subspace and reappear at his mark. Which means Minato can do what Tobi does, I.E. capture people in Subspace, which pretty much makes him the most Hax'd out thing in existence

    C) Minato can do ether one
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2012
  38. Sniffers Ninja dogs ftw!

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    Okay, I want to clear something up about VIZ. I read somewhere they edited some scenes. For example, Shikamaru never smokes in VIZ unlike the original manga and that Neji's forehead seal has been changed. Is this true? Do they censor much?
     
  39. takL unfit 4

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    the thing is that viz translators obviously speak jp as natives while scanlators...
    and they also have more time than scanlators

    as for DBs.....reportedly kish said he never knew curried pilaf was rock lees fav food at jf.:ninja

    thats why i cant wait for their trans for bees 'her well used nip' line.:nuts
     
  40. lathia ༼ ▀Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ ༽

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    @taKL, I remember you mentioning that Kishi has absolutely nothing to do with the DBs. I believe you said the editors were the ones responsible for them.

    I always looked at the DBs as a mere "strategy guide" mirror. Simple and sometimes correct interpretation of the manga. However, sometimes data is made up for the sake of making the series more "interesting or complete."
     
  41. takL unfit 4

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    i didnt say 'absolutely nothin' but yea im sure he doesnt write them. i think the detabook writers consult with him. the wordings are so different from his style. he wouldnt call himself kishimoto-sensei to begin with.
     
  42. Turrin 玄武

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    Yeah they censored Shikkamaru smoking by editing out the cig, but I don't notice much censoring at all in the Viz scans. I think they only censor really controversial things, like showing a kid smoking in a comic marketed primarily to kids.

    Not sure about the Neiji thing since I don't have that volume though.

    If your trying to say Kishi doesn't write the Data-books, he clearly does since there is no way anyone else could know this information. Also he is credited as the author.

    When it comes to your statement, I think it's likely that Kishimoto asks his assistants or editors for some help in coming up with information for the Data-book, I.E. what should Lee's favorite food be, which is why he said he never knew Lee's favorite food was curried pilaf, because he didn't until someone else told him to make Lee's favorite food curried pilaf. Ether that or Kishi just never said this and reports were wrong.

    Ether way it outright say in the book

    Naruto [Hiden . Sha-No Sho] @ 2008 by Mashashi Kishimoto

    Of course there are other people involved in the project who help with editing and compiling the Data in a solid book form as there is with many other books, but Kishimoto is certainly credit as thee main contributor to the book and as the author.
     
  43. takL unfit 4

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    commmon sense says he clearly doesnt. he is credited as the author of naruto.
    read my previous post. n what lathia said is about it.

    for instance,
    the editors: caramel mama, hidenori(?) suzuki, toshiki ishide, shigeyuki(?) watanabe, akira(?) uchida, masayuki sai(?), kiyohiko takrzaki and shueisha are the ones who actually wrote the db rin no sho.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2012
  44. Harbour I stole all bitches.

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    Turrin, was in 3rd DB something else interesting about Minato/his techs that we didnt know?
     
  45. Turrin 玄武

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    He is credit as the author of the Data-book itself as well:

    "Naruto [Hiden . Sha-No Sho] @ 2008 by Mashashi Kishimoto"

    Also common sense says that he is the author not only due to the fact that he is credited as such, but the fact that the Data-book includes information no one but Kishimoto knows and even hints at events that haven't happened in the manga yet or characters that haven't even been addressed in the manga yet. For example the Data-book says Sasori wants to fight the original puppet master Monzemon, who was never mentioned in the manga, the Data-book also credits Monzemon with the creation of the 10 puppet technique. Only Kishi would know the existence of said character, unless you believe someone else was just making up characters that never existed.

    What I posted alread is pretty much the only interesting thing I found so far about Minato and his techs that wasn't in the online translation. But I haven't read the whole book yet, so I'll post anything else I find interesting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2012
  46. takL unfit 4

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    didnt i say the detabook writers consult with him earlier?

    im afraid no jp speaker would read the text off those dbs and think kish wrote it himself.
     
  47. Jizznificent Your unborn bro

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    lol.

    it still seems like they are saying that izanagi is a variant of the sage's banbatsu sozo. izanagi is just based on banbatsu sozo's principle of creating something (nature/beings/life) out of nothing. they are fundamentally the same but have different practical uses.

    i guess it could be said the sage had the potential to use izanagi but it is likely not something that he actually used or even though about.

    i'm not quite sure where you're getting the "philosophy" part from...

    thanks.

    maybe kishi just forgot he wrote that. :lmao
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2012
  48. SageEnergyMode Active Member

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    Yea, I just think it's a case where the Uchiha found a different use for the same exact power. Perhaps a power they felt was more combat appropriate.
     
  49. Turrin 玄武

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    I don't know how you can deny Kishimoto the author of the book if it outright credits him as the author. Now perhaps Kishimoto had someone write the information down for him while he dictated, but all the info comes straight from Kishi other wise he would not be credited as the author. Though personally I think any difference in the text your seeing comes from the fact that Kishi probably writes a book differently than he writes the dialog of a manga.

    Ether way it doesn't matter since all the info is coming from Kishimoto and therefore is as accurate as anything else.
     
  50. takL unfit 4

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    guess you gotta be a native to see it. i mean kish wouldnt go 「いざ解き放ち敵を滅さん!!("now thou shall release it to slay thine enemies!!" ? haha im no good in imitative archaism)」 which would be like me suddenly speaking greek.
    i doubt they consult kish on things like each charas fav foods, height, weight dob, blood type and stuff.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2012

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