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Minato vs. Itachi

Discussion in 'Naruto Battledome' started by Yagura, Jan 25, 2011.

  1. Yagura ♥ ≠ ∞

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    Minato vs Itachi

    Restrictions: None.
    Knowledge: Manga.
    Battlefield: Amegakure; X
    Starting Distance: 15 meters.
    State of Mind: Minato & Itachi are bloodlusted.
    Conditions: Itachi is healthy, and his eyes are in perfect condition.

    Scenario 2- No knowledge.

    Scenario 3- No knowledge. Bloodlusted. Standing 5 meters apart.
     
  2. Meruem The King

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    Well, if Minato survives Tsukuyomi he wins but I am on the fence of whether or not he can.
     
  3. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    This match's victor depends on whether or not you arbitrarily believe Minato is immune to genjutsu. In terms of intended level, they are about the same, Minato might even be higher, but feat-wise, in the Battledome, Itachi should win. Tsukuyomi, Amaterasu, Susano'o, genjutsu, and clones are far better tools than Hiraishin and Rasengan. Itachi is also more reflexive than Minato since Minato was compared to Raikage without his lightning armor.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2011
  4. Scorpion GET OVER HERE!

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    Scenerio 1: Minato should win. He has the ability to warp away attacks like Amaterasu, and the Totsuka Blade. If he manages to tag Itachi, it'll be an easy win. He should be out of the Tsukuyomi range.

    Scenerio 2: Essentially the same as above.

    Scenerio 3: Itachi wins. 5 meter starting distance with no knowledge means Minato is going to get hit by a Tsukuyomi. Sure he'll survive it, perhaps be in a better shape then Kakashi was, but in no way will he defeat Itachi.
     
  5. Meruem The King

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    I agree with Devil for once. Haha, let's make a Pain vs Minato thread and see if we still agree...
     
  6. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    How does he know when Amaterasu is coming if he's not looking at Itachi's eyes, and why wouldn't he look at Itachi's eyes without knowledge? Also, Susano'o, Utakata, and clones? It's a lot to warp away from and still put up some minor form of offense.
     
  7. Scorpion GET OVER HERE!

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    If he keeps his distance Tsukuyomi shouldn't be a factor. And doesn't he have the speed to dodge Amaterasu anyway considering Raikage's speed was compared to him.

    He has the speed to dodge most of those things and counterattack with a Rasengan. But yes Itachi has a very good advantage with no knowledge.
     
  8. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    Why would he keep his distance without knowledge?
     
  9. Scorpion GET OVER HERE!

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    Why wouldn't he? After an attempted V2 Hiraishin foiled by a surprise Susano'o, which in that he will definitely stay back.
     
  10. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    Why would Itachi need Susano'o for v2 Hiraishin when Itachi has the single best feat in the manga for countering Hiraishin? He could easily block every kunai Minato throws and make a Karasu Bunshin while doing so.

    X
     
  11. Nikushimi Savior

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    Manga knowledge means Itachi should understand what Minato is capable of pretty well, whereas Minato will have virtually no knowledge on Itachi other than the fact that he's an Uchiha (as well as the general capabilities of Sharingan). Bloodlust means this fight is going to get insane right off the bat, with Itachi spamming MS and Minato evading with Hiraishin. However, Itachi's more detailed knowledge plays to his advantage; I see Minato's ignorance getting him caught in Tsukuyomi very early in the fight, and that's it for him. Itachi wins with low to moderate difficulty.

    Before anyone starts bitching, consider how vital information is when dealing with both of these characters. It's like they say: "Knowledge is power."

    I suspect if Minato gets within range of Itachi, he'll be Genjutsu'd, and he'll need Hiraishin to free himself from Itachi's influence. This will give both opponents a chance to see eachother's primary abilities in action. However, eventually, I think Minato would manage to catch Itachi off-guard and win via BFR. Itachi would probably be so focused on trying to keep track of Hiraishin, that I can see Minato catching him off-guard with a space/time barrier and hurling him to regions unknown for a "ring-out", if you will. If for some reason Minato is unable to do that, then it would come down to whether or not he could successfully get around Itachi's defenses with Hiraishin or if Itachi could successfully anticipate and fend off such efforts. In that case, I can honestly see it going either way.

    Itachi rapes with Genjutsu and a kunai. The conditions are ideal for him and he can make far better use of them than Minato can.
     
  12. OutlawJohn Spirit of the Free

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    Not that I disagree, but how does Itachi have better reflexes than Minato, who's explosion feat makes him the only hypersonic base character in the manga?
     
  13. Namikaze Minato Konoha's Yellow Flash

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    Minato knows Uchiha techniques consumes lots of chakra , so he wait out Itachi with Hirashin and Itachi is forced to keep susanoo since its the only thing between Minato Hirashin to kill him.

    in the end Itachi's chakra finish and he loses.
     
  14. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    @Outlaw John

    We can argue about the subjectivism of individual feats, ranting about pointblank explosions or natural lightning, but the statement that A's reflexes surpass Minato's own is enough to satiate my opinion that Itachi has superior reflexes, through his feats with Sasuke, and through Sasuke's feats with A.

    With that said, I do acknowledge that Minato is vastly superior with the shunshin jutsu from what has been shown, but I believe Itachi has experience fighting advanced shunshin users, like Sasuke or Shisui, and do not believe that to tip the scale either way, just my opinion.
     
  15. Empathy Disciple of Thunder

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    OP says no knowledge in both scenarios
     
  16. Bloo Shadow Shinobi

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    There was no Mangekyou users in Minato's lifetime(aside from Madara who we've yet to even see his Mangekyou outside of s flashbacks) so how would he know about them?
     
  17. Milan? "order."

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    I think you read the manga wrong o:
    It was stated that A's speed was almost on yondaime's level :l
     
  18. BrokenBonds Blinded by Instinct

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    Minato doesn't have knowledge, he loses.

    He wont know what Tsukuyomi is, that being said he wont be so die hard on trying to avoid eye contact.
     
  19. OutlawJohn Spirit of the Free

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    The problem with that is, Itachi's feat can be argued to be a 'trigger draw'. As much as I hate to say it, Sasuke gave him ample time to prepare to activate his technique. Another simple matter of fact is, if Itachi actually reacted to the lightning, then his reflexes are far above anything in not only the Narutoverse, but also the HST. If he actually did it, then he should be able to react anything and everything in either Naruto, One Piece or Bleach, and have ample time to react. But obviously, he can't, so we accept that he did a 'trigger draw'.

    Minato's feat, on the other hand, can't be debated. He saw the explosion, teleported away from it, and then used Shunshin to get out of the way before it could do harm to him and his son. Clearly illustrated by the manga.

    And you base that entire argument off of one arbitrary comment by a character who's likely never even met Minato, and said something impressive about his leader without likely having any scope of Minato's abilities.

    The same statement is completely nill, seeing as Minato's feat easily puts him in a class of his own reaction wise.
     
  20. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    Were you reading the printed manga, or some obscure internet translation? I assure you, it was stated that Minato was comparable to A without his lightning shroud. This is the English translation in the actual manga:

    "Lord Raikage's nervous system and reaction speed are on par with Kohana's Yellow Flash. I'm surprised these folk are managing to keep up. But Lord Raikage can also amplify his ability further using Lightning Release armor...not even the sharigan will be able to keep up."

    I bolded the words that I do not want you to miss. Of course, you can discredit the source as ignorant if you would like, but I do not, and I do not read the manga incorrectly, like you guessed.

    @Outlaw John

    I'm not familiar with your opinions, but a portion of the forum does believe that Sage Naruto micromanaged actions while the Rasenshuriken was in transit, and they believe that the Rasenshuriken to be vastly hypersonic. In that case, reacting to lightning is not out of the question. I am unfamiliar with Bleach or One Piece so I cannot comment on that bit. There are other ridiculous arguments that I could make for Itachi's speed, by basing it off of Sasuke's escape from c0, for example, but I'm not going to because I prefer equalizing the feats with character statements.
     
  21. Namikaze Minato Konoha's Yellow Flash

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    no knowledge about Itachi , not Uchiha , Minato was the Hokage while Uchiha were alive and Kakashi had his sharingan , he knows Sharingan consume chakra to use its ocular powers more than Minato consume chakra for doing Hirashin
    i didnt say he'll know about Itachi's jutsu , i said he knows Sharingan ocular powers consume a lot of chakra since Uchiha were alive while he was alive and Kakashi with his sharingan is alive too so he knows what a toll the sharingan takes on the chakra , so he only need to keep Hirashin till Itachi lose all his chakra from being forced to keep susanoo up due to Hirashin
     
  22. Chaotic Gangsta Active Member

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    To be honest, with no knowledge, it could possibly go either way. Seeing as Itachi is completely oblivious to Minato's transportation ability, that's automatically an advantage for Minato, however, him being unware of Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan abilities is an even greater disadvantage. You must look into an opponents eyes when fighting them, and there's a 90% chance he'd do that. So Itachi has a better chance of winning.
     
  23. OutlawJohn Spirit of the Free

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    Those people are -snip-. Rasenshuriken is calced at around Mach 3, which is believable as most Naruto characters are believed to be around supersonic.

    Well, the only thing you should know about Bleach and One Piece is that their all miniature versions of Dragon Ball. They made bullets look slow in their first appearances, and now have characters that apparently move around light speed.

    And I personally prefer to go by numbers, especially when the only statement we have to go by is one that is totally unfounded. One what grounds does Shi have the authority to make claims on Minato's speed? After all, he's likely never met Minato, and all he has to base his opinion is off is likely what he's heard about Minato's speed. All of that comes into question considering that Minato's feats in base are beyond anything except the Raikage's V2 speed.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2011
  24. Empathy Disciple of Thunder

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    No Knowledge means No Knowledge(obviously) on the character whatsoever, that would be Manga Knowledge, meaning they know nothing about the character at all, like a stranger
     
  25. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    Itachi activating a technique in 0.001 seconds is implausible compared to Naruto unhenging and strapping down Deva when a Mach 3 projectile was only a dozen feet away? That doesn't add up to me.
     
  26. Milan? "order."

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    are you absolutely sure?
    I don't think he surpasses the yellow flash, but he could indefinitely be considered on par.
    but as you'll see X he is shown to be too fast for Madara, also X..
    so they are on par, raikage doesn't surpass him.In speed.
    plus, how do we know he's not talking about yondaime's base speed, what about yondaime's seal that allows him to teleport, nothings faster than time-space travel :hurr
     
  27. Sadgoob Editing Specialist

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    The first links was when Tobi had Minato pick up a bomb. The second link shows Tobi expertly phasing through Minato's blow and then reflexively ending the phasing jutsu to grab his wrists. Those were exemplary reflexes on Tobi's part, actually, when you consider the chakra control necessary to phase and unphase as quickly as Minato strikes, and then to grab his wrist as well.

    But you're absolutely correct about Hiraishin; you can't beat that in speed. But it is limited by a kunai, and Minato's own reflexes after instantly going from point A to point B. It was ideal against Tobi because Tobi literally allowed the kunai to go through his back. I'm not sure if it would have worked as well as it did otherwise, and I believe that by deflecting the kunai the threat is nullified.
     
  28. Namikaze Minato Konoha's Yellow Flash

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    no knowledge means no knowledge on the opponent , not the clan , your logic would be correct if this was a match between Minato VS Uchiha clan.

    and Uchihas are famous with their good looks , Minato will recognize them and thus recognize Itachi.
     
  29. Skywalker Imperial Conqueror

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    Tsukuyomi rape should be banned, it's not much of a challenge for the third match, at all.
     
  30. Nikushimi Savior

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    Except that's completely false, because we can plainly see that Kirin was fired before Itachi had activated Susano'o, making his reaction feat indisputeably legit.

    Well...yeah. That's the idea. He's definitely not anywhere near the fastest characters in the HST as far as movement speed is concerned (lol, Kizaru), but he should be able to at least activate Susano'o to prevent virtually all of them from blitzing him.

    Wait, what the fuck do you mean "obviously he can't"? How many characters in the HST are faster than lightning?

    He also saw the explosive tags before they detonated. Claiming this feat is legit while calling Itachi's feat a "trigger draw" is a ridiculous double-standard that has absolutely no basis in objective reality.

    Sharingan hardly consumes any chakra at all for people with Uchiha blood. It has a heavy toll for Kakashi because he lacks the clan's Kekkei Genkai and his body isn't suited for the eye as a result.

    Minato has no knowledge. Period. He'll have to figure out Itachi is an Uchiha before he can even begin to think of how to fight him, and by then, he'll most likely have already eaten a Tsukuyomi under bloodlusted conditions.

    Yes.
     
  31. Namikaze Minato Konoha's Yellow Flash

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    so ur saying susanoo is a piece of cake for Itachi?
    what makes u think Minato will eat a Tsokoymi before Minato use Hirashin since he's BloodLusted?

    and Minato's reflexes > Itachi , Hirashin > activating sharingan ,after that activating MS , after that activating Tsokyomi.

    dont give me the Itachi has the fastest reflexes thing , cuz he couldnt react to Hebi Sasuke's Gennin Shuriken trick not to mention that Hebi Sasuke is vastly inferior to Raiakge.
     
  32. Nikushimi Savior

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    I said that Sharingan was not exhaustive. I did not extend that to Mangekyou Sharingan or its accompanying abilities, which obviously take a great toll on the caster. But Minato has no knowledge, and he'll likely be killed as soon as he sees Itachi's Sharingan and realizes he's fighting an Uchiha. Because...really...how else is he supposed to know?

    It depends on the starting distance. In the first scenerio, with a greater starting distance, I can definitely see Minato relying on Hiraishin first- it's pretty much a given. However, he has to reappear somewhere to attack, and without knowing the dangers of even a moment's eye-contact with Itachi, he's likely to fall prey to it.

    In the third scenerio, he just happens to be already within Tsukuyomi's range when the fight starts, and he's given no knowledge of what he's in for. It's an obviously disadvantageous position for him to be in.

    Activating Sharingan/MS is quick and we've seen that Itachi can cast Tsukuyomi without any apparent delay if he wants to. It's a lot quicker than Minato taking out a kunai and throwing it.

    Erhm...that rigged shuriken hit Itachi when he was in mid-air...and Zetsu still said the only reason it hit him at all was because having Tsukuyomi broken fucked him up. He was adamant that Itachi should normally have been able to dodge it.
     
  33. Tengu Kiuuby-chan

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    Itachi wins all three scenarios. without knowledge, Minato doesn't stand a chance, he only needs to get hit by Tsukuyomi/Amaterasu once to lose, + the location is in Itachi's favor since he can use Suiton.
     
  34. Corax Active Member

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    Without knowledge Itachi will win but with extreme diff. No knowledge on MS is a lot worse than no knowledge on hirashin. Minato s style is evolved around a close combat (rasengan,etc) while it is very dangerous to fight a MS user without knowledge in close combat. Itachi can use Tsukuyomi or Amateratsu on him while Susano can protect at least from 1 hirashin blitz. Just look here X Minato was lucky that Madara didnt use genjutsu on him here. Without knowledge it is pretty dangerous to charge like this even with V2 hirashin prepared. And Itachi s reaction time is very good (0,001 second,to be precise) so more likely that he would land his amateratsu/tsukuyomi in time.
     
  35. supersaiyan146 Active Member

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    In this situation a normal Hirashin should work since Minato can appear within a certain radius of the tagged Kunai...
     
  36. Sorin Active Member

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    ^It's one thing to say that Minato loses but to actually say he doesn't have any chances is BS.Stop wanking Itachi and underrating Minato.It's obvious that Yondaime is no push-over for characters like Tobi,Itachi,Orochimaru,Jiraya etc.

    Every scenario is a toss-up.None is rape.

    That being said i actually see Minato being favored in the 3 scenario.He doesn't need to throw a kunai to use hiriashin.The one he has on him is enough to activate hiriashin.

    X

    In the above page we see him land a few feet away from the kunais.That means that he can teleport anywhere in a radius of several meters around the hiriashin seal.This could mean that being bloodlusted he begins with hiriashin speedblitz.Though the effectiveness of the speedblitz depends of how fast Itachi activates Susano'o.He may eventually survive and beat Minato with a genjutsu after that.

    Edit: for KUKU nr8
     
  37. Corax Active Member

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    He can transport instantly but he cant attack instantly. At least he need some time to make a rasengan or swing his hand for a kunai stab/place a tag on Itachi. Susano activation time is a lot less than this. So this will be a bad move. Itachi will counter-attack with Tsu or Ama if this fails. But Minato can play smart and try to outlast Itachi s Susano. Still Itachi can land a Tsu or Ama in any close combat encounter. This is why i think that Itachi wins with extreme diff.
     
  38. Sorin Active Member

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    X

    ^This seems pretty fast to me.:hmm

    Edit:He can kick him in the face w/o much difficulty though.
     
  39. Corax Active Member

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    No. Madara had no troubles at phasing through his attacks. Itachi has a greater reaction feats. His reaction feat is easily in top-3. Personally i think that top-5 feats are Raikage s (obviously), Itachi s (Kirin),Deva path s (FRS dodge), CS-2 Sasuke s (outrunning an explosion) and Minato s (outrunning an explosion).
     
  40. Sorin Active Member

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    lolwut?

    Madara was blitzed by hiriashin 2 twice.

    .

    X

    Melting arm and probably torso disagrees with you here.

    X

    This also.

    Where the hell do you find that Madara can easily avoid hiriashin?


    And how do you quantify these reaction feats?
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2011
  41. Corax Active Member

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    Once. And this time it will be very dangerous to try anything like this X. Why?I think you know why. It is very dangerous to be so close to a MS user without any knowledge on Tsu or Ama. And this only worked because Madara phased through it. Itachi more likely would try to deflect it with his own kunai. Different opponents different tactics. This move was good vs Madara but it doesn't mean that it will be good vs everyone.
     
  42. Sorin Active Member

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    Twice.Look at my post above.

    Why does it have to be the exact same scenario?Not every battle is the same.At the begining of the fight they stand 5 meters apart.Minato can use hiriashin w/o running towards itachi since the distance is already small.
    Again.He can teleport in a radius of few meters.He doesn't need to throw shit at the start of the fight.The kunai in his pocket is enough to teleport to itachi.
     
  43. Corax Active Member

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    He can teleport lol but he need to prepare his rasengan to attack. And this isnt instant in any way.He prepared beforehand his rasengan in his fight with Madara. Itachi will have enought time to respond with his very fast jutsus. This mythical blitzes are impossible. At best Minato would have enough time to tag him with a seal and even this is debatable because Itachi has Susano.
    To make my point clear. Battle starts. Tsu and Ama are instant. Hirashin is instant. However rasengan ist. Who will win? Blitz tactics are useless vs top tiers. Minato will need a lot more complicated tactics to win. "attrition war" tactics/style will be the best here because Itachi cant hold Susano for a long time.
     
  44. Sorin Active Member

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    I never said anything about blitzing and doing a rasengan at the same time.He can shove a kunai in his face,he can kick him in his face,he can fart in his face(lol) etc.

    The only thing i said that the 5 meters scenario isn't as one sided as everyone was saying like "lol genjutsu rape,minato is pwned".He has tools too.All 3 scenrios are hard for both of them.
     
  45. Namikaze Minato Konoha's Yellow Flash

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    and Itachi will react this fast Because he reacted to Hebi Sasuke's Shuriken Trick right?
    like i said , Hirashin > activating Sharingan then Activating Mangekyo Sharingan , then Activating Tsokyomi when the opponent is looking.

    seems a a lot of work for something that you claim is "Instant"

    quick but is it Instant? , and Minato using Hirashin require only 1 stage which is throwing a knife or touching something in the Battlefiled , now that is 1 phase , but Itachi needs 2 phases to reach Tsokyomi that the opponent must look at to activate , seems like Minato's fight method is faster than Itachi , thus even withitn 5 meters Itachi will be Killed before he has the chance to utilize tsokoymi since the fastest technique in the manga belong to Minato and it is INSTANT , unlike Itachi's techniques.

    this is not the library dude , in battledome we only use feats dude and by feats Itachi cant react to Gennin Trick that Hebi Sasuke did who's vastly Inferior to Raikage who's been compared to Minato ,do you see the difference between Itachi and Minato?
     
  46. Kakashi Hatake ก็็็็็็็็็็็็็็็็็็็

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    With no knowledge, Minato loses to Genjutsu/Tsukiyomi especially at that distance.
     
  47. Sorin Active Member

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    Typical response is typical.:apathy
     
  48. supersaiyan146 Active Member

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    Ahaha...All ur responses are in vain...:p...

    Btw just a question : What'll happen Itachi activates Susanoo when Minato has a Kunai on his throat just to slash it?
     
  49. Skywalker Imperial Conqueror

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    Wank much? Minato is on his level, Genjutsu isn't doing much to him if Itachi can't even cast it on him.
     
  50. FreeWorld Banned

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    Which is going to be easy since mintao will make weye contact.

    Itachi takes it 10/10
     

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