1. Miss Akihabara 2017: Preliminary Round: Nominations & Qualifications (inc. Naruto and one piece).
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Magician

Discussion in 'Akihabara Records' started by Black Mirror, Jun 28, 2012.

  1. Morglay .

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    Will he eat Iremi instead? :maybe
     
  2. ClandestineSchemer Active Member

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  3. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    Wouldn't surprise me if Edermask makes Iremi's hidden power into his primary project after this, given that it's also supposed to have infinite mana. I'd like to see Enzu going his own way with his swordsmanship (mainly finding the inner peace that will continue to elude him until he stops being such a beta), and Iremi gaining physical strength in some way or another. This encounter (and the one with Fenelia) should really emphasize to both of them where their biggest weaknesses are.
     
  4. Mat?icha アナル

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    Nice read, i like it...
     
  5. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    Spoiler: At first I
    X

    Spoiler: But then I
    X
     
  6. Morglay .

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    Wait? What? Is that... The Queen diva?
    Spoiler:
    X
     
  7. Kevintju One Piece Rocks!

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    Latest chapter is out, Beginning (05). Man, shit is gonna hit the fan if I understood the chapter correctly.
     
  8. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    I think you did, and IT'S ABOUT FUCKING TIME :gar
     
  9. Morglay .

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  10. Kevintju One Piece Rocks!

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    Enjoy! Is all I'm going to say.
     
  11. Lord Genome Spiral King

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    i wish this ancient monster wasnt so underwhelming
     
  12. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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  13. ClandestineSchemer Active Member

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    This feels way to much like a deus ex machina to enjoy this outcome.
    Not only can she fodderize the monster, but she somehow knows how to use all her power to the furthest extent?
    All this skill, despite the fact she was always sealed and could never even attempt to use her powers, makes her feel really cheap.
     
  14. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    This is obviously a different Iremi entirely from the one we know. Her whole personality is different, and she both knows about and has control over the full extent of her powers.

    It's clear to me that this Iremi would wipe the floor with any other character in the entire series, even Huan + Janus + Fenelia going all-out, so she probably isn't here to stay. This whole multiple-personalities business is certainly going to become the focal point of the plot now.
     
  15. Seraphiel Meem Magician

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    There was no other way to defeat it and it was set up so this would happen, literally everything since Fenelia lead up to it. It's pretty easy to stomach.
     
  16. ClandestineSchemer Active Member

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    Her awakening and being a major factor was obvious from the moment the monster was mentioned.
    Her utterly annihilating it on the other hand, is completely anticlimactic.
    Its not even exciting seeing her do this shit.
    After all that build up on the unrivaled monster, Iremi completely humiliated it.

    Its terrible writing, imo.
    The fact it was hinted at and predictable doesn't make it good.
    I could write a story and show a guy praying at the beginning, then reveal the gods are real and that they even help out occasionally.
    That doesn't mean having one appear at the climax of the story and have him handwave the threat away, a good twist.
     
  17. Morglay .

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    And with this Edermask has his way of stomping Janus.
     
  18. ensoriki Dicey

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    This isn't Iremi.
    If anyone played Xenoblade...you might know what Im thinking.

    Yeah it might be the "original" personality or it might be the case that it's a separate being that has been dormant in Iremi since before Wandra found her.

    Could you imagine...if this is Natasha? Same girl Timeh was watching for Edermask?
    She was a comatose immortal from Janus & Edermask time right?
    Lol if she took refuge inside Iremi
     
  19. Morglay .

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    That would be quite the 3 way.
     
  20. Kevintju One Piece Rocks!

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    Nah the way this Iremi spoke it was clear that she was another soul/personality using the same body, but had always lied dormant because of the seal. Dormant in the sense that it had no control over the body, yet it kinda knew what's going on on the outside. Just a classic case of an evil and a good using the same body, which I think has been used in stories all the time.

    I don't agree that this is bad writing, though it did felt a bit forced. The power gap between the monster and Iremi is large now, but don't forget the monster's energy it had stored for so many years is transferred to Iremi. The monster now only has his near immortal body to rely on. This case of deus ex machina can at least be explained.
     
  21. Morglay .

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    So wait, is it possible all the Runes/spells Iremi has read over the years - that reinforced her seal, could now be used practically in combat? If so then Wandra really fucked herself with that idea.
     
  22. Lord Genome Spiral King

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    Agreed

    This is a monster who was hyped as pretty much having the whole world unable to kill it and rivalin janus and now hes getting toyed with

    Ill wait but it would have been more appropriate to have her on a similar level not a whooe tier above everyone in the manga

    Now its gonna seem dumb if she later struggles or doesnt appear again
     
  23. Sphyer ~

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    Yeah, I have to agree that all that hype/drama this entire time just for Iremi's alter ego to not just win but absolutely curbstomp hardcore is kind of downer in some sense. I can understand why it's happening though but yeah, it isn't really something I'm enjoying too much either.
     
  24. ensoriki Dicey

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    I think its because this Iremi will be set up eventually as a threat.
    So evolve the alter-ego immediately into wtf tier.
    The entire battle was set up to hype Iremi.
    We've been intentionally given the idea her other personality might be dangerous if she is less then this monster and they eventually squeezed out a win then she still remains something they can handle as a group.

    As it is now its impossible to handle this iremi who is beyond the AM. The only point in that is if Iremi is a threat going forward. Even if she lapses back after the fight they now know if she resurfaces they can all be wiped out without any ability to resist given the style of this story they will immediately talk about Iremi and their safety around her.
     
  25. Lord Genome Spiral King

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    well this has gone terribly imo
     
  26. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    god dayum that was quick :zaru

    Seriously, this seems like a damn good prediction to me, just a little off on the timing.

    Also, I'm liking how Iremi as a character is coming to be a clever twist on the typical "monster inside me which makes me stronger" trope. Iremi instead IS the powerful monster, and the one sealed inside was just a rampaging personality.
     
  27. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    X. Interesting turn of events. Now it all makes sense.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2014
  28. Nanja Member

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    It's still shit-tier writing though.

    That escalated and was resolved way too fast. The pacing was terrible from the start of the monster fight.

    Also, why the hell is she even that strong? It's pretty ridiculous and makes it seem like every other major character, Janus included, probably aren't in her league.
     
  29. Sphyer ~

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    I'll agree to a degree that the pacing did feel really slow and the conclusion of the monsters defeat was so anticlimactic after so much build up. Iremi's otherside being able to draw so much power to fodderize that creature really left a bad taste in my mouth.

    Kind of a shame how things turned out since this fight started out pretty good.
     
  30. ClandestineSchemer Active Member

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    This was a text book deus ex machina.
    She literally appeared to solve their problem and was immediately sealed back into her box by Jung as soon as her purpose ended.

    As an optimist the only silver lining I could find here, is the fact I can completely empathize with Edermask disappointment with this conclusion.
     
  31. Lord Genome Spiral King

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    also i like how he said about so many sacrifice were made when no one died lol
     
  32. ensoriki Dicey

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    No one had to die, they all put their lives on the line for Edermask and there is nothing to show for it that is what he means.

    I feel kinda sorry for "real" Iremi, it is her body. If she didn't go off on this initial rant about killing everyone...I'd be a real dilemma. Shoot girl even likes Enzu and said she'd kill him anyways.

    Like I said I think this is going to be a substantial talking point. If that seal breaks none of them have the strength to stop her from killing them and the "real" Iremi definitely holds something against them.
    However I think the fact that Enzu was asleep currently would make him (predictably?) the solution in the future.

    The real qualm is if they don't do anything with real Iremi going forward. If she existed literally just to come in now and go away its pretty silly.
     
  33. Morglay .

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    I imagine she will play a big part in the story to follow. If she doesn't then that will be fully retarded.
     
  34. Mizura Meh Advisor

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    You guys, that's why I like Kubera more. It has a seemingly slow start, but it has a coherent storyline that focuses on building up plot and character interactions (in both intensity and complexity) rather than focusing on hype like Magician often tends to do. If anything, Kubera underhypes events and characters that could would have received tons of hype in Magician.

    There are parts I like in Magician, but I gag whenever the characters join in on a hype chorus (Omg, he's so strong! Was he always like that? As expected). xP
     
  35. ensoriki Dicey

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    I have no doubt, just stating in relation to Clandestines comment.

    What power hype?
    The AM was created for the soul purpose of revealing the real Iremi and how dangerous she is.
     
  36. Mizura Meh Advisor

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    Magician hypes characters allllll the time. Do you need examples?
     
  37. ensoriki Dicey

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    The hype doesn't mean anything Magicians "power tiers" pretty much dont move. We pretty much had all our "upper levels" established from part 1 and then new characters just hover at that strength at best. The power hype is mostly relative to Enzu.

    The brother & sister? Relative to Enzu.
    Guard captain? Relative to Enzu.
    Kal? Relative to Enzu
    Shadow? Relative to Enzu.

    We get continually that Enzu isn't anything compared to Iremi...sealed.
    We get that Janus, Edermask, Matthews father, Fenelia, Edan, Huan(?) all operate around a "upper level".
    AM was supposed to break that normalcy, for the purpose of showing Iremi is above everyone.

    Magician hypes characters but we already know that relative to Edermask most of those characters are at best on par or weaker. So the characters strength isn't a big deal unless it goes against Enzu because anything weaker then Edermask is fodder to Iremi.

    Going with that....you take in the different locations and see it as a adventure manga...because really the only one whose really showing any "shounen" kinda growth is Enzu. Everyone else is already stagnant.


    Kubera displays the strength gap between characters and not infrequently at all.

    If Magician has any fault to Kubera its that Kubera plays with the idea that you don't know all the pieces and lets you try to think of what the full picture will be. Magician doesn't really build its mystery. In fact despite being the major thing driving everything forward, I still don't really get the deal between Janus and Edermask, nor does it really matter at this current moment.
     
  38. Mizura Meh Advisor

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    I'm talking about the part where the characters are often standing around going 'ooh' and 'aah' at everything. It really irritates me. Ever heard of show vs tell? All the characters in Magician are always 'telling' how impressive this or that character is. For this last arc, for example:

    Spoiler:
    I heard multitudes of seals have been placed here. Will Yoong be alright by himself?
    If he can, he must be considerably skilled.
    H-his hand is emitting light?! ( <- oh come on, they never saw magic before?)
    So bright...
    Th-this is...
    Wow...

    Wh-what's this all of a sudden?!
    Has the thing gone insane?!
    I feel my head ripping apart just from his laughter!
    The entire place is trembling...
    I can't take this any longer!!!
    This crazy...!

    [Insert super long talk between Dortellis and Janus on how awesome humans are]

    I-if Yoong showed any sign of hesitation, he would have attacked him immediately.
    I'm beginning to feel the killing intent in this room rising.
    Hoh.... what are you planning? Are you Really planning to listen to that human being? Who in the world is this human for you to act as such? To think this five thousand year old seal would be broken this simply... How amusing, how truly amusing...

    Wh-what incredible killing intent.
    Merely opening this path is this awful? T-to think my body would start trembling on its own...
    This feeling is similar to that of Ajussi nin years ago
    Yeah. This aura is near identical to the one that made me gain consciousness back then. If there's anything different, it's the fact that this ancient monster lets off this aura naturally. We may be feeling killing intent, but that monster is simply breathing.

    This world longs for a ruler. The seat that I have once lost... desperately calls for me...
    Perhaps it's due to having been imprisoned for so long... but you talk too much. (<- I definitely agree with This part)

    What outrageous power.
    Although that thing isn't the main body, maybe we stand a chance.

    Truly impressive. Have humans already become this powerful existence?
    As I feared. Did that attack have any effect?
    Looks like we're in for a long run.
    I wonder if there will even be room for us to get involved...
    Haa, at this rate, I can't see an end in sight.

    H-he decimated the surroundings in an instant?
    Are you telling me he's this powerful even when he's sealed?
    If we take a single hit from this...

    But apart from that, I have to say that I am surprised. To be honest, I feel rather moved. Are you truly a human being? I can't be sure, but I feel you would be able to stand your ground against Dortellis. What in the world occurred for a human being to become such a powerful existence? Humans were an existence stuck in the middle of larger forces, constantly under threat. The weakest and most powerless race were human beings.
    Have you that much confidence? If not... Have you overestimated where you stand due to your conceit? Either way, there is no change in what I have to gain... but meeting someone like you is a first. Just What is it that is making you this desperate?

    D-don't tell me the chains themselves are...
    Now we Really reached the point of no return.
    To think all these chains were seals...
    Now we don't have any choice other than to move forward.
    All we can do now is believe in Ajussi...

    Ahh, much better than before. This time, my body is overflowing with power. How marvelous. My regeneration speed has increased. [...] How impressive. It seems I have sorely underestimated your abilities. That power rivals or even surpasses Dortellis' level of strength.

    Something about that just feels... extremely stupid. Instead of commenting about the killing intent, for example, it could have been 'shown' in a visual panel. There's a recent example of that in Assassination Classroom, for example:

    Spoiler:
    [X

    Instead, in Magician, they just stood around and kept talking (the fact that they're blabbing at all kind of kills the tension). I don't want the people narrating how scary and powerful he is, I want to see for myself. And the fact that the monster kept going 'ooh, aah, impressive, BUT' also feels rather silly. If you're an overwhelming monster, act like it.
     
  39. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    New chapter is out. Can someone who actually remembers stuff tell me what Cantera is and why Edermask is so shocked at hearing it?
     
  40. Morglay .

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    Its that thing two or more guys do together that everybody knows but no one bothers to speak about.
     
  41. ClandestineSchemer Active Member

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    It explains why the monster possesses infinite magic.
    Cantera is the name of their world/planet.
    This would imply he is the embodiment of the world itself.

    Now I wonder if Iremi's lineage is directly connected to him or is he speaking metaphorically, calling humans the children of the earth (or Cantera in this case).
     
  42. ClandestineSchemer Active Member

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    Now we know it was a metaphor. Everything on that planet is his child.
    Also I really started to feel for him.
    Which is surprising, considering his attitude in that fight.
     
  43. Kevintju One Piece Rocks!

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    I think the parent child thing was meant pretty literally. He actually created everything, including all living beings. I must say his story is pretty interesting, but knowing his background story, I find it even more unbelievable how evil iremi could fodderize him that easily. He's supposed to be top class God-tier, even in his weakened state. Ah well, let's see how this goes on, the author had written a great story so far, so my faith in him is not lost yet.
     
  44. ClandestineSchemer Active Member

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    Yeah. I really hate the author giving her ultimate power.
    It just makes her boring to me.
     
  45. Morglay .

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    Eyes of God and the heart of God... Edermask got a serious buff.
     
  46. Onihikage Truth, Love, and Wisdom

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    There's a Part 3 now? And we have to wait until the end of November to get it?? :argh
     
  47. ensoriki Dicey

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    Nenomius..... Finally a name I can shorten.

    Welcome.... El Neno.
     
  48. Sphyer ~

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    Didn't expect to learn Edermasks true name so soon.
     
  49. ensoriki Dicey

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    El neno can't be beat...ignoring iremi.
    Funny how Enzu was unconscious for it all.
    Especially when the real Iremi praised him and said shed kill him at the same time.
     
  50. Morglay .

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    Well don't know what Arumio can against the current Edermask. Not sure how long Edan and Fenelia will hang with him, and seeing as he has unlimited mana now Arumio can't really wait for him to tire out.
     

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