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Digimon Tier List - Part 1

Discussion in 'Meta-Battledome' started by Tazmo, Apr 1, 2012.

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  1. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    The only powerscaling Armagemon has is being stronger than Omegamon and weaker than Faildramon Plot Mode.
     
  2. Weiss What We Do In Life Echoes In Eternity

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    Adevnture Omegamon got stronger over the years after Adventure, right ? :hmm
     
  3. Adamant soul Well-Known Member

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    Well the there is still the rumour that Omegamon from the Xros Wars Manga may or may not be Adventure Omegamon. :maybe

    Otherwise sadly we don't know, he seemed pretty much equal to his first appearance when he fought Armageddemon as far as I could tell and if he was stronger there isn't any way to know how much.
     
  4. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Apokarimon is a highly impressive digimon who is sadly underestimated.
    X
    He should be pretty awesome after taking a Speed Equalizer x1.

    So is Imperialdramon. Will mention the stuff about him later(cause I hate him). He should have the best speed feats in the entire season.

    Some more impressive stuff from Movie 3:
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X
    Wendimon turned the void into a nice summer day with a sun.
    Wendimon, according to official info, can create his own dimension, manipulate space-time, and freely pass through dimensions - he did this in the movie, which confirms his profiles to be true. And it is only an Adult. (Champion level for you dubbers) :geg
    Cherubimon can do everything he can do and MORE.
    Speaking of Cherubimon:

    Hikari: This is still our world. The world was modified, for that Digimon's sake
    X
    X
    Cherubimon pretty much modified the entire world. Likely Planetary/dimensional reality warping.
    I'd say >>>Frontier Cherubimon.

    All credits to you-know-who for bringing this to attention. (slightly modified)
    More coming up later.

    I'll end this post with a profile of a powerful ultimate Digimon:
     
  5. Weiss What We Do In Life Echoes In Eternity

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    want GranDracmon and Fanglongmon feats :datass


    and that 'God' of the verse
     
  6. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Dunno about the 'God' of the verse but that god entity mentioned in Bagramon's profile has been revealed in the manga.
     
  7. Tranquil Fury Leech Lord

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    That info was probably mentioned in the thread but really?Who was it?
     
  8. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Homeostasis.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2012
  9. Tranquil Fury Leech Lord

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    So
    -Manga is an alternate timeline judging by Bagra's comment on Taiki
    -Drasil is the same as Savers?Homeostasis
    -Digimon could once evolve more commonly
    -Homeostasis was created by Drasil?

    ?Not sure I quite understood the parts with Drasil but interesting.
     
  10. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Figured I'd probably mention this stuff now that the calc is done.


    1
    Spoiler:

    We've had this for a while now but were unsure of how to interpret it:
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X
    The XW Digital World is vastly different from the other digital worlds. Levels don't exist, it was broken into zones, older than the RW, etc.
    The Digital World was usually considered secondary in other seasons with it being formed from the split of the RW but in here, it is pretty much the opposite.
    So didn't know whether to regard that as comparison between just the main planets of both worlds or the entirety of the worlds.

    Then we get this from the translated manga:
    To summarize:

    • Our universe, just one of the 108 zones/dimensions in the Digital World.
    • Exists at a structural level/plane higher than ours.
    • All the processing resources of our universe not enough to simulate/host it.
    • There might still be stuff in the final bonus chapter which is yet to be translated.
    • The Digital World is older than the RW and also much much larger.
    • Our universe was most likely a part of the Digital World itself before it broke up into zones.
    • Map of the Digital World from the manga(includes the HW):
      X


    2
    Spoiler:


    We've got a calc for how big the DW is compared to the RW. (Credit to ChaosTheory123)
    Spoiler:

    tl;dr: The XW Digital World is about 142 times larger than our universe!!!


    So to summarize:
    In total, there are 108 zones.
    One of them is a confirmed universe.
    Leaves us with 107 zones.
    If we could get the number of zones which are below universal size(island, continent,etc), we could probably subtract it from the total.
    I believe there were about 30-40 zones shown in the anime/manga which were about island-continental level.
    107-30=77.
    If this calc puts the universes at 142, it would mean most of the other zones are universe sized or even exceed it. :hmm


    3
    Spoiler:

    So, what changes with this new info? It means we are getting more multiversals. :ho
    No kidding.

    The XW Digital World can be pretty much considered a multiverse in which our universe occupies just a small portion.
    Basically, some feats are now much more impressive than before and we're going to need to revisit some feats and also work on the newer ones from the manga.
    The XW manga is supposed to be just an alternate timeline so the universe should be the same.


    MOST IMPORTANT!!! MUST READ

    Spoiler:

    WARNING:
    DON'T CREATE A THREAD USING THESE CHARACTERS FOR NOW.
    DON'T EVEN CREATE A VERSE VS VERSE THREAD. OR ONE OF THOSE MULTIVERSAL COUNTING GAMES.
    IN FACT, DON'T DO ANYTHING.

    You'll die. :sun

    There's still some shit that needs to be posted and some stuff that needs to be sorted out.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2012
  11. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    4
    Spoiler:

    I'm going to cover some stuff. Whatever I didn't(like the stuff about Mille) will probably be handled by the others.

    New and revised feats
    (mostly the upper tiers)

    • Bagramon with CC(for formatting the entire Digital World, anime). Multiversal.
    • DarknessBagramon(D5, anime). Multiversal.
    • Shoutmon X7SM (oneshotted DarknessBagramon, anime; defeated UltimateKhaosmon). Multiversal.
    • Baguramon's generals traveled throughout the entire Digital World, collecting those code crowns. Whereas Taiki and the others were collecting crowns from the smaller zones.
    • XW Zeed. Multiversal. Not as powerful as the original but still:
    • Homeostasis (One of the three gods equal in power to each other and whose fight lasted for a hundred days and caused the digital world to break up into zones, the same one mentioned in Bagramon's profile, manga). Multiversal.
    • Yggdrasil( One of the three gods, now he shows us why he's more impressive than we ever thought, manga). Apparently, the same one from Savers...I'm not even going to get into what that might entail. :maybe
    • Someone yet to be revealed (One of the three gods, see above, manga)
    • Some stuff from Bagramon:
      Not sure what to make of the above. Continuation:


      Possible Multiversals
    • UltimateKhaosmon(haven't read his part, should be a multiversal threat at the minimum, manga)
    • NEO (if that Yggdrasil stuff can be cleared)


    5
    Spoiler:
    Digimon Xros Wars strength feat (calc by BlazXBlue)
    X

    That's probably all for today. Someone will probably post the other stuff. :maybe

    Now you can start the discussions.

    CREDITS
    --------
    They were good people.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2012
  12. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    But you can't intermingle manga and anime canon, because they are different continuities. :zaru
     
  13. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    It's just an alternate timeline. The universe should be the same, with pretty much the same origins.

    But yeah, I'll leave that open to discussion.
     
  14. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    There are discrepancies between the anime and manga canon, you can't wriggle out of them.

    And trying to use the anime screenshot to prove that the DW > HW? Very shaky, if not fallacious outright. Wisemon in the anime stated clearly that the area he was showing was "how much the humans are currently using of the Digital World", as in the anime continuity, the humans utilized a percentage of the DW's digital area with their information technology - in fact, IIRC Wisemon stated that it was the humans' interference that split the world, which is completely different from several manga continuity explanations. "Utilizing the Digital World" is not the same as "existing as a part of the Digital World".
     
  15. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Meh, I'll wait for some other opinions before laying this to rest. I'll also need to check out one or two things.
    The "continuity" part won't be much of a problem. The other stuff probably will.
    RL, you fox-you've wasted my efforts. You need an arrow to the knee. :maybe
    I'll be back. :pek

    I'd like to see that.
     
  16. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    It's 54 episodes, this is going to take some time. :zaru
     
  17. Vicious Fur immer

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    X
    X
    X
    X
    X

    I'll talk about some stuff soon - just woke up. :zaru
     
  18. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    You just saved me a lot of effort :zaru

    In any case, basing arguments on faulty conjectures is something I don't want to see people doing around my watch :pek:gun
     
  19. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Hey, Fox-kun was supposed to provide those. :pek

    Also, I doubt you guys noticed but I posted some more stuff other than the universal-multiversal stuff.
    Go read that.
     
  20. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    It does not matter how many arguments you choose to make, I'll crush them all!!

    But really, I already basically tore apart the first 4 points like wet tissue paper :)maybe), the 5th one is solid but not really overly notable, it just giving more accurate numbers to a previously established feat.

    :canttouchthis
     
  21. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    I'm going to kill some furries before I post next time. :maybe

    Its just that almost all the people I discussed this stuff over with...they overlooked that sentence. :maybe
    Anyways, this thread exists to discuss stuff so...no big deal. :zaru
    I'm still looking at some stuff about that still so...this isn't over. :LOS
    There's still a shit ton of stuff to post and discuss. :ho

    Now now don't be hasty, there's a lot of good stuff from the manga I posted which still stands. You're just not looking at it. :maybe

    It's pretty good.
     
  22. Tranquil Fury Leech Lord

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    Anime has it being stated the digital world came first and the human world was imitating it. The whole human Digi power thing.
     
  23. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    I've read the translations, you can't beat me in my own game :maybe:gun

    In brightest day, in blackest night,

    No wanker shall escape my sight.

    Let those who wank with fallacies' might

    Beware my power--RandomLurker's light!
     
  24. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Quite sure you've missed some stuff. :maybe
    It's quite cheesy.
    3/10 for effort. :zaru
     
  25. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    It does not matter what fallacy you have, as their might is in vain!

    The Digimon Lanterns stand back not in face of any wanker!
     
  26. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Jokes aside, I'll admit I overlooked some stuff due to carelessness.

    Now stop labeling me that or else :maybe:gun.

    Spoiler:

    There's still hope if I find that one thing I'm looking for... :maybe


    That said, we still have an entire universe as a zone in the manga. :ho
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2012
  27. ~BLAZxBLUE~ Legendary Tamer

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    Some stuff still stands, such as a universe being a zone. Also, Homeostasis and XW Yggdrasil are at least universal now, which means Savers Yggdrasil is actually universal as well, seeing as they are the same entity :maybe
     
  28. Hououin Kyouma Mad Scientist

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    Dat Masaru's universal level punch...
     
  29. ~BLAZxBLUE~ Legendary Tamer

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    Now with full confirmation :zaru
     
  30. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Yggdrasil acts as the host/main computer/god for an entire Digital World(pretty much a creator entity) so he'd always be universal at minimum.
     
  31. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    FFS, Masaru didn't kill Yggdrasil. We still hear it speak to him in the ending and it even gives Suguru his body back. Masaru destroyed the body but didn't do jack shit to the spirit/soul/whateveryouwannacallit. Even if the soul has universal durability, the body Yggdrasil used in the battle is nowehere proven to be so. Heck, even the Burst Modes by themselves were able to blast a hole into it, it just regenerated from it. The whole point of Agumon BM/Masaru punch was that Yggdrasil couldn't regenerate its body and was forced to abandon it. That kinda proved to it the point they were trying to make and thus it stopped with the whole universe erasing plan.
     
  32. Tranquil Fury Leech Lord

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    He did'nt kill it but Agumon BM+Masaru after being empowered with all those emotions proved too much for drasil's power, it ran and that was before it started freakin out. Should be below X evolution Omnimon X and Next's Victory Greymon in tier list(also Zeed Gururumon from Next who was around even with Victory but below Neo).
     
  33. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    Base Alphamon would be below Omnimon X.
     
  34. DarkLord Omega Nightmare Ruler

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    Shouldn't Zeed from Xros be stronger than game Zeed. Based on Feats and ignoring the only Ryo is his weakness. Also the fact that Xros universe is larger than the rest, that's also a plus for him too.
     
  35. Vicious Fur immer

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    I believe Homeostasis was created to watch over Yggdrasil after that incident when it wanted to destroy the Human World. By whom? I have no idea - it could be the true God of the DW or it could be a completely different being.

    Some more quotes for Homeostasis (I don't think Mohsin posted these):

    Thanks to Garmmon and Nez

    So going by this, the Homeostasis is capable of inspecting all the data in the universe, but doesn't do so in detail because it's a tedious job. In addition, in the small portion of data it inspected, it was able to get some information about the future as well. Yggdrasil made similar calculations in Savers as well.

    Homeostasis and Yggdrasil should be around the same level of power in my opinion, and there's possibly another God out there too. Personally, I think it's Huanlongmon, because he is the only other being in Digimon who has been called the "God" of the DW (the old God of the DW, and could have been replaced by Yggdrasil).

    Why do people still continue to believe that Apocalymon only has Gran Death Big Bang? :geg

    He needs to be bumped up. Same with Lucemon Child - this guy has all of the DW's data, has the mark of the DH, and fought the Warrior Ten. Lucemon FM while having access to the Dark Area can potentially be multi-dimensional/universal.

    --
    It's possible that Apollomon Whispered's feat could be much more impressive than we originally thought considering the size of the continents.

    X

    There's a total of 8 lands, each land is seemly around the same size, except for Bagra's Pandemonium. We assume if the lands combined, it would make a planet, at least the size of Earth unless stated otherwise - yes it's possible that it's bigger than Earth, but that would simply make the feat better. This can give us an idea on how big that continent is, and may even be calculable. I don't see any reason why it would be smaller.

    According to Apollomon Whispered, his dark sun would have incinerated the continent. Incineration/vaporization would bump up the feat quite a bit.

    X

    Assuming this is correct, you can fit a total of 50 moons into Earth (if you break them apart). Apollomon Whispered was going to destroy 1 out of 8 of the lands, with each land likely being around the same size except for Bagra's Pandemonium land. I think it's rather obvious that Apollomon Whispered would be beyond country level - he should be in the multi-continent+ range, if not higher. In fact, it's possible that he can reach planetary levels with incineration/vaporization. Sadly, I don't think anyone would be bothered to do this calc because I believe incineration/vaporization calcs are tedious, at least I would think (I would be happy just knowing the size of the continent).

    ---
    I'm going to try to get into detail with Lilithmon's dimension feat.

    Here's some of the dimension before Lilithmon starts collapsing it. Each floating hexagonal field had various mountain-ranges and what not. Then there's the ground beneath (we can't even see the whole thing, but not only that, you can see a curvature like that of a planet [the ground with the hexagonal symbols]), which I assume each can fit a hexagonal field (or at least close to it). Then after that, there's the space ITSELF - Lilithmon was affecting everything, not just the floating hexagonal fields.
    X

    Here's when everything started to get absorbed - you can see the floating hexagonal fields (EACH had mountain-ranges and what not), the ground beneath, and even the space itself getting twisted and pulled inside.
    X

    In addition, I am trying to figure out if the lights in the background are more floating hexagonal fields, or stars, or somehow the Bright Land.
    X
    X
    X

    Anyways, the feat seems much more impressive when someone actually goes into details. Lilithmon was twisting the space, then created some type of black hole, which started to pull everything faster. She then planned on erasing everything and created a large explosion, which actually reminded me a lot of Apocalymon's self-destruct explosion.

    EDIT: I will probably edit this post a little more.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012
  36. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    I could do the Apollomon incineration calc. I have enough experience on physics (I've actually done an evaporation calc before).
     
  37. Hououin Kyouma Mad Scientist

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    So Lilithmon was twisting space, land and everything else and then she created some kind of black hole? Well, that looks like some very heavy gravity field/distortion, maybe she was distorting the very fabric of space with gravity...
     
  38. Tranquil Fury Leech Lord

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    Ryo's threatened to take out all eras/dimensions/worlds if his limiter is down i.e everything in the digimonverse goes which would include Xroswars. His power was supposedly sealed by some god. Xros wars seems like a homage but not upto par. Is Xros wars Zeed that strong?If so pretty impressive of him.
     
  39. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    I'm done with my calculation for Apollomon's continent busting feat. I'll post it soon.
     
  40. Calamity when it strikes you're out

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    That was quick. :maybe

    Speaking of which, XW Zeed is pretty broken too, just not on the original's level.
     
  41. Vicious Fur immer

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    That'd be awesome if you could.

    Beware - lots of links with screen shots.

    Here's when Apollomon fused both Lilithmon and Blastmon, along with the negative power of the Hell's field. Negative energy is known to create dimensional imbalance.
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X

    Everything, the floating lands, the ground beneath, and the space itself slowly gets twisted (you don't even see everything here, either)
    X

    She then creates a vortex or something underneath, which starts pulling everything straight into it
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X
    X

    And then the explosion. Pretty much a self-destruct, similar to Apocalymon's Gran Death Big Bang. In fact, Lilithmon and Blastmon here remind me of Apocalymon quite a bit.
    X

    I still do not know what is behind Apollomon. It could either be more floating lands, or stars, or somehow Bright Land.
    X
    X
    X

    And Lucemon FM from DSAM:

    DW itself is failing apart - you can see the fabric of the DW falling apart
    X
    X

    A huge tear in the sky appears - the boundary between worlds is collapsing
    X
    X
    X

    Digital Hazard symbol, which means a potential big threat to the DW itself
    X

    Causing negative distortions
    X

    Yuma commenting on what she feels; the most dreadful, the saddest, etc - it's the negative energy
    X
    X
    X

    Dark Area seemly engulfs both worlds (negative energy - X)
    X
    X
    X
    X

    Lucemon FM's goal
    X

    This feat reminds me of what Armagemon did in "The Digital World in Imminent Danger", where he created some type of black hole (might be a gate to the Dark Area), which was breaking down the fabric of the DW itself. Lucemon FM w/Dark Area was seemly doing the same thing.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012
  42. Hououin Kyouma Mad Scientist

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    Yeah, the scans show some kind of gravity distortion around her or something that looks a lot like it...
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012
  43. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    Here's the calc.
    Spoiler: Physics inside
    Energy for sublimation (change of solid material straight to vapor) is equal to the sum of the energy required to first heat it to melting point, the energy to melt it, the energy to heat the liquid into vaporization point and the energy to vaporize it. (X)

    Presumptions:
    - The rock mass of the Land is composed homogenous of granite.

    Energy to heat the substance to melting point = E1 = c1*m*∆t1
    (c1 = special heat capacity of solid rock, m = mass of rock, ∆t1 = change of temperature in heating the solid)
    c1 = 1050 J/kgK for granite
    ∆t1 = 1215 ?C - 20 ?C = 1195 ?C (estimating transition from room temperature to minimum melting point of granite)
    (X)

    Energy to melt substance = E2 = sm
    (s = heat of melting, m = mass)
    s = 3350 J/kg for granite (X)

    Energy to heat the liquid to vaporization point = E3 = c2*m*∆t2
    (c2 = special heat capacity of liquid rock, m = mass, ∆t2 = change of temperature in heating the liquid)
    c2 = 1570 J/kgK for granite
    ∆t2 = 2960 ?C - 1215 ?C = 1745 ?C (transition from minimum melting point to minimum vaporization point of granite)
    (X)

    Energy to vaporize the liquid = E4 = rm
    (r = heat of vaporization, m = mass)
    r = 4,800,000 J/kg (X)

    Mass calculation
    X

    Approx. width of Pandemonium in pixels = 371
    Approx. height of Pandemonium in pixels = 286
    Approx. widht of a Land in pixels = 105 (measured from a land further away from the camera, as the Pandemonium itself is also further away, more specifically the one on the left with the red crystal.)

    Presumptions:
    - Each land is circular-shaped when viewed above.
    - The Pandemonium is roughgly cone-shaped.
    - Every other Land is roughly hemisphere-shaped.
    - All the land masses put together form a volume that is equal to the Earth.

    V(Pandemonium) = 1/3*πr?h = 10,305,818 px?
    V(Land) = 1/2*4/3*πr? = 303,066 px?
    V(total)= V(Pandemonium) + 7V(Land) = 12,441,280 px?

    V(Earth) = 1.08*10^12 km? (from Wikipedia)
    Thus 1 px? = 86,807 km?

    V(Land) in km? = 2.63*10^10 km? = 2.63*10^19 m?

    m(Land) = ρ(granite)*V(Land) = 2700 kg/m? * 2.63*10^19 m? = 7.101*10^22 kg
    (The density of granite comes from my book of physics formulas and constants :zaru)

    Final calculation

    E(sublimation) = c1*m*∆t1 + sm + c2*m*∆t2 + rm = 6.25*10^29 J


    For comparison's sake:
    Gravitational binding energy of Earth: 2.24*10^32 J
    GBE of the Moon: 1.24*10^29 J
     
  44. ~BLAZxBLUE~ Legendary Tamer

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    Lol, Apollomon and Anime X7 confirmed to be close to planet busting :zaru


    EDIT: Needs to be converted into niggatons :zaru
     
  45. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    1 Gt TNT = 4.184*10^18 J

    6.25*10^29 J / 4.184*10^18 J = 1.49*10^11 Gt
     
  46. ~BLAZxBLUE~ Legendary Tamer

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  47. ~BLAZxBLUE~ Legendary Tamer

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    That aside, the Xros Wars tier list needs some major updates.
     
  48. Hououin Kyouma Mad Scientist

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    How much energy is needed to blow up the moon or the planet?
     
  49. RandomLurker Quick Brown Fox

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    I gave the gravitational binding energies for the Moon and the Earth for comparison in my calc post. Gravitational binding energy (GBE) is regarded as the minimal value to destroy a large celestial body that is mostly held together by its own gravity.

    The result value is above moonbusting by a multiplier of 5-6.
     
  50. Hououin Kyouma Mad Scientist

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    Very interesting, thanks.
     
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