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[317] No kyuubi aura around Naruto = No Kyuubi chakra Usage

Discussion in 'Konoha Library Archives' started by PoopTart, Jul 27, 2006.

  1. PoopTart Member

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    There is no sign of kyuubi's red chakra aura around naruto. Naruto is using his own chakra. Kyuubi-suppression theorists FTW!
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2006
  2. Grrblt Banned

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    No kyuubi aura=Yamato controlling it for him. Kyuubi-control theorists for the win!
     
  3. Odlam Team 7 4 Life Advisor

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    Victory indeed, sweet sweet victory
     
  4. PoopTart Member

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    Nope, its been shown in the manga that Naruto emanates a visible aura about him when he uses Kyuubi's chakra. Therefore, the lack of kyuubi chakra proves that he is not using Kyuubi. Everything you stated was a guess at best.
     
  5. SaiST 鎧袖一触 Advisor

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    Where was that aura when he summoned Gamabunta(on both occasions)?

    This doesn't prove anything. There aren't always visible changes when Naruto uses the Kyuubi's chakra. Moreover:

    315:

    <Kakashi> And if Yamato doesn't suppress the Kyuubi's chakra... It could be a hundred times more.

    <Naruto> !

    <Yamato> That's why you're the only one who can handle this kind of training, Naruto.


    Naruto swore off his tailed transformations, not the Kyuubi's chakra entirely. Come to terms with this, folks. >_>
     
  6. Lahickson blades of truth

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    Thats not 100% correct. Naruto is always using kyuubi charka because the seal allows kyuubi charka to flow and mix with naruto's. In this case naruto's own charka is the dominate charka, even tho its still kyuubi enhanced. When kyuubi charka is visible and he has the eyes etc. Thats when kyuubi's charka is the dominate one because its not over shadowing naruto's, not the usual naruto's over shadow his.
     
  7. ansoncarter Active Member

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    still undecided but he did summon that many clones against gaara without using kyuubi

    maybe he really does have 100x kakashi without kyuubi? really hope so.

    If he's only got 2x that sucks and I hate naruto forever and will never forgive him
     
  8. pavister Member

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    he's only got 2x in base mode estimately
     
  9. Frieza Destroyer of Worlds

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    This is great news.
     
  10. Serenity Silk Does want a Custom Title

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    He hasn't had the kyuubi aura at any point in part 2 except for when it becomes the fullblown chakra shroud

    If you really have to have a way of hyping Naruto then I can give you one -he's so much better at controlling the kyuubi chakra now that it's all contained within his body instead of spilling out into an aura
     
  11. Descent of the Lion What 0Fear has always been

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    He swore off of KYUUBI.
     
  12. SonicTron Active Member

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    I never want to hear another one of these threads from another one of you people screaming that naruto isn't using kyuubi. I can't believe the lengths you people go to in order to tell off the naruto-haters by trying to prove that naruto is superman even without kyuubi. Get over it, he uses kyuubi, he's using it now, end of story.
     
  13. Cytrin SuperDuperUltraMega CoolPerson

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    Nobody is going to change their mind now both sides think they are correct.
     
  14. PoopTart Member

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    Occasion one: While falling from the cliff, he had his eyes closed and went into his 'spirit world' where kyuubi resided. When he opened his eyes Gama was beneath him. We had no way of seeing the chakra aura.

    Occasion two: Gaara had covered him in sand and we couldnt see him then either.

    There are multiple translations. My guess is the one you have is wrong. It doesnt agree all the other statements Naruto and Yamato said about NOT using the Kyuubi chakra. Kishi spent way too many pages on those points to just completely ignore them 2-3 chapters later.

    Based on your translation...This is how the story is going...

    Yamato: kyuubi is poisoness, im going to suppress its chakra. You need to rely on your own power or youre going to hurt those you wish to protect.

    Naruto: You say the kyuubi is stunting my natural power? I hurt my baby's mama while using the kyuubi's chakra? Im gonna rely on my own power from now on!

    Yamato: Ok, scratch all that. Were going to use kyuubis chakra in training.

    Naruto: OK.

    Now, I know those aren't the EXACT wordings(Naruto didnt say Baby's Mama) BUT according to your translation this is whats going on now. That statement just doesn't tie in with all the other details they have been discussing lately which leads me to believe that its an error made by the translator.

    Also, if Yamato DOESN'T have to suppress the chakra for this training to work. Why is he there CONSTANTLY channeling a jutsu?
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2006
  15. Kisame Banned

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    look he was using the kyuubi. Thats the whole reason Yamato was there.... So he could use it safely.


    Not because he thought it might leak out accidently.
     
  16. Descent of the Lion What 0Fear has always been

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    Naruto is not using Kyuubi at all. If he was then Yamato would only need to work when Kyuubi started to take over Naruto's mind. But no, he working as long as Naruto is training. That means no Kyuubi at all.
     
  17. Grrblt Banned

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    There are multiple translations, all state that he will use Kyuubi chakra.
     
  18. Turrin 玄武

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    thank you voice of reason(the person that posted this thread)
     
  19. SaiST 鎧袖一触 Advisor

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    You guessed wrong: X

    I believe the reliance on the Kyuubi's power Yamato referred to was the chakra shroud. There's even an image of KN4 when he refers to that reliance.

    There was a logical reason for him to completely suppress the Kyuubi's chakra in the previous mission due to Naruto's unstable emotions, and his willing acceptance of the Kyuubi's dominant influence.

    Let me re-word that for you.

    <Yamato> The Kyuubi's chakra shroud is a danger to both you and the people around you, and due to your impatience you willingly allowed the Kyuubi to overtake you. Because of that, I will completely suppress the Kyuubi's chakra from this point on. The fact that you're still alive after the 4th tail proves how strong your own chakra is, you have the potential to be just as strong without relying on the Kyuubi's power.

    <Naruto> 'k.

    <Kakashi> You'll have a hundred times my amount of chakra if Yamato doesn't suppress the Kyuubi's chakra, Naruto.

    <Yamato> That's why you're the only one who can do this kinda training. I'll be here as insurance to make sure you don't start poppin' tails. :thumbs

    <Naruto> I rox.


    The "power" of the Kyuubi that Yamato referred to, Naruto's reliance on that power, which produces the chakra shroud(nice picture of KN4 being shown in the same panel this is being said in), that's the "power" I believe Naruto swore off.

    It can easily be seen your way, so I'm not going to say it's silly that your'e holding on to that belief. Just look at it in the general context of things: Naruto using controlled amounts of the Kyuubi's chakra has never been an issue, Kakashi and Jiraiya never got on Naruto's case for that. It's the chakra shroud that's got everybody sweatin' bullets.

    They weren't entirely specific about it in the previous arc, so it's understandable that people would think it's the Kyuubi's chakra entirely. I'm tryin' to get people to look at the whole picture so there won't be any bitching when Naruto's using Oodama Rasengans with the Kyuubi's chakra later on 'n' such.
     
  20. SonicTron Active Member

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    oh god forgive this mere mortal
     
  21. R3trograde Il n'y a pas de hors-texte.

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    This is just total bullshit. We hadn't seen teh Kyuubi shroud until the VotE fight, but we know he was constantly using kyuubi chakra.
     
  22. Continuity .

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    God, I knew people would still insist on this... I made a thread last week predicting this.

    Naruto is using Kyuubi chakra without losing his control over it. (tails) Yamato told Naruto not to rely on the Kyuubi, and he isn't. The chakra is there, and if it can be used without the Kyuubi's interference, it's a very good thing.

    If the Kyuubi was just going to be supressed and unused at all, Yamato would not have a reason to be there. The Kyuubi was already supressed, so why did Yamato come back? Yamato is WORKING right now. If Naruto could simply undo the supression by using a lot of chakra, what would be the point of supression in the first place?! No, what he is actually doing now is letting the Kyuubi chakra be used by Naruto while at the same time keeping Kyuubi itself from interfering.

    Because of some early translations, some people, like PoopTart, are confused. PoopTart can't read Japanese. The passage was negative, meaning Kakashi said if Yamato does not supress the Kyuubi, Naruto can have 100x Kakashi's chakra. It wasn't positive, it was negative. Learn to read Japanese and translate it yourself before calling others wrong, PoopTart. It's insulting.
     
  23. PoopTart Member

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    So now theyre saying Dont rely on this chakra but you HAVE to use it for your training? Thats relying on it.
     
  24. oronisi ...

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    Ok how about this. The kyuubi is a tool (a very dangerous power tool). Before, naruto was relying on this tool, and in fact, turning to use the tool every chance he got and letting the tool use him.

    Yamato told Naruto to stop relying on the tool. In fact, Yamato gave Naruto props for being able to use the tool in the first place. They Kyuubi inside of anyone else we've seen so far would mean death to the jinkukri. Yamato told Naruto he needed to rely on himself. This does not mean never use the tool that only you can use, it means don't use the tool unless you need to, and you use the tool, don't let the tool use you.

    But:

    Naruto is training on his own: Naruto doesn't need kyuubi to maintain that many clones, he would only need kyuubi to recreate those clones again and again. I think Yamato is helping Naruto supress the kyuubi chakra so that Naruto has access to all of his chakra for training AND helping to leak kyuubi chakra over (convert it) into Naruto's chakra so he can train non-stop. Notice, Naruto hasn't even broken a sweat even though Yamato looked like he'd been hard at work holding his hand out for hours.

    See, everyone wins. Naruto is special because he's the only one that has the potential to use the kyuubi to its full extent without having the kyuubi use him and take control. Naruto is training on his own power, and only using the kyuubi power to maintain training constantly. Without it, he would still be able to do the training, he'd just need to take more breaks.
     
  25. Grrblt Banned

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    He's relying on the chakra now so he doesn't have to rely the transformations later.
     
  26. bearzerger Major Cliff Allister McLane

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    but usually atleast his eyes changed
     
  27. Continuity .

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    Yamato said not to rely on Kyuubi, after he had gone to 4 tails. Naruto is using free chakra, and the Kyuubi can't interfere because of Yamato. Sounds like something Yamato, Naruto (or anyone with a brain) wouldn't oppose.

    Naruto has been using Kyuubi chakra for much longer than he has been using tails, and he didn't have any problems back then. But now since the seal has weakened so much, he can't use too much of Kyuubi's chakra without losing control to Kyuubi itself, and it's manifestation is tails. Imagine if you can still be able to extract that power without losing control? Well now they can, with Yamato there.
     
  28. PoopTart Member

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    Yamato never specified the shroud, he was talking about the kyuubi chakra in general. You're putting words in his mouth whereas I just summarized their conversation.
     
  29. Continuity .

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    Yamato never generalized the Kyuubi chakra, he was talking about the shroud in specific. You're putting words in his mouth whereas he just summarized their conversation.

    Anyone can say something like that. Why not use logic in this? Do you not admit there's a difference between using Kyuubi chakra and having the Kyuubi take over completely in a tailed transformation? Keep in mind here, even when Naruto is in 1 tail form, the Kyuubi is still directing the chakra shroud and movement, independently of Naruto. At 4 tails, he loses complete control, and is unable to do anything before the Kyuubi. Now, of the two (Kyuubi chakra for Gamabunta or tails), which is more logical to be opposed by Yamato?
     
  30. Grrblt Banned

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    Usually Yamato isn't there to help him control the chakra. Transformations have always been a sign of an overflow of chakra; Yamato is letting out just as much as he needs so there are no transformations now.
     
  31. SaiST 鎧袖一触 Advisor

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    As I said, he talks of Naruto's reliance on the Kyuubi's chakra with an image of KN4 in the background. He speaks of Naruto seeing through his own eyes instead of the Kyuubi's, likely referring to the Kyuubi's influence over Naruto when the chakra shroud comes forth.

    I'm just making sense of the whole situation, since Kakashi and Yamato have made a very obvious implication that Naruto will be using the Kyuubi's chakra for this training. I'd hate to see a bunch of threads in a few weeks about how stupid Naruto and Yamato are for contradicting themselves--they aren't.
     
  32. Continuity .

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    Well said.

    I don't like seeing such confusion... I recommend to everyone they wait each week for a translation from highly reputable translators like Nihongaeri and Yoshitsune. Not that the others are bad or wrong, it's just that you can't go wrong with these two, usually. I always wait for one of their translations. Feel free to add more names to this list.

    It's the same issue with people that confused Hidan and Kakuzu, some translators had them backwards, and people believed it. You can't trust every translation. I'm sure there's many more examples of this, like with this Kyuubi chakra confusion.
     
  33. Descent of the Lion What 0Fear has always been

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    Its the opposite. If Naruto was simply using Kyuubi's chakra Yamato would only be put to work when he was needed to hold Kyuubi's tails down. Naruto never needed aid to use Kyuubi's chakra before. Sounds like someone doesn't understand. Yamato can only supress Kyuubi when he is NEAR Naruto. He is surpressing Kyuubi as we speak, which means he doesn't want Naruto to use it at all. Yamto is not filtering chakra, he's not regulating chakra( because Naruto's seal does that already). He supressing the chakra, period.
     
  34. PoopTart Member

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    Well said.

    I don't like seeing such confusion... I recommend to everyone they wait each week for a translation from highly reputable translators like Nihongaeri and Yoshitsune. Not that the others are bad or wrong, it's just that you can't go wrong with these two, usually. I always wait for one of their translations. Feel free to add more names to this list.
     
  35. PoopTart Member

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    He said chakra...not shroud. Which makes my argument relevant and yours...not.
     
  36. Continuity .

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    Don't get me wrong, it's cute and all that you said that, but it's slapping you in the face seeing as how Yoshitsune has a translation that reads...

     
  37. Genieman Random guy

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    Hmmm… there are two threads with the exact same name and context right now. This one and the one in Naruto Theories

    Well we could go with that there is none of the other signs that Naruto is using the kyubii’s chakra.

    Here are the signs I think of when Naruto uses the kyubii chakra. These are the signs that everyone uses when saying that Naruto used the kyubii chakra in all the other arguments about it (like the can “Naruto summon gamabunta without kyubii” thread).

    - his eyes look more like a cat’s eyes then a humans
    - the “whiskers” get bigger and more pronounced
    - he gets an aura around him (even happens when he is not using a tail)
    - his demeanor changes (he becomes angry and abrasive)

    well all of those things are not happening right now. He looks and acts completely normal. You could say that Yamato is keeping the kyubii’s chakra under control for him. I’m not saying it is absolutely positive that Naruto is using his own chakra but if he is not why aren’t any of the signs of using the kyubii’s chakra showing up on Naruto. If he is being given the kyubii’s chakra, even gradually wouldn’t he show some signs of it?
     
  38. Uzumaki~Kakashi Tomoyo's #1

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    This chapter did almost nothing to support either side of the argument because there was no hard facts. Just more speculation and theory.

    Believe what you want to believe in the end it's all the same Naruto is only 100x in this training and will never actually be 100x. Unless Kyuubi gets extracted:? Or he uses tails again.
     
  39. PoopTart Member

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    Thank you. That has been the point of this whole thread which everyone has evaded up until now.
     
  40. SaiST 鎧袖一触 Advisor

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    The Seal that was said to be weakening in the previous arc, no?

    Despite what was said in Chapter 315?

    <Kakashi> And if Yamato doesn't suppress the Kyuubi's chakra... It could be a hundred times more.

    <Naruto> !

    <Yamato> That's why you're the only one who can handle this kind of training, Naruto.


    I addressed that point in my first post in this thread. Where was the aura you brought up in your initial post when he used the Kyuubi's chakra to summon Gamabunta on both occasions?
     
  41. Descent of the Lion What 0Fear has always been

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    Just because Naruto has more chakra when Kyuubi is not surpressed doesn't mean he can make and maintrain 1000 bunshins by his own merit.
     
  42. I Я Reckless! shoot 'em dead

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    I think that if he was using the Kyuubi's chakra, the Manga would have made it obvious that he was doing so.Since there is no proof that he's using it, logically we should assume that hes not
     
  43. Waraji Random Random Random

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    the kyuubi chakra runs through him no matter what. I thought yamato was just trying to keep it under control so he doesnt produce the aura.
     
  44. PoopTart Member

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    OOOH! SO youre saying its OK to use the chakra...You just cant have a red glow about you cuz its a fashion disaster...NOW I GET IT!
     
  45. SaiST 鎧袖一触 Advisor

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    We have seen him make 1,000 Kage Bunshins with his own chakra, even Kakashi can use Tajyuu Kage Bunshin, his chakra reserve isn't enough to maintain the technique long enough for this kind of training to work.

    That's kind of the key, isn't it? This training is supposed to be going on continuously, these Kage Bunshins are supposed to be sustained for a number of days--isn't that the impression we were given? Kakashi can't sustain the technique long enough to get any kind of benefits with his chakra reserve, but Naruto has around twice as much and it works out for him just fine?

    I don't think that kind of difference justifies it. The Kyuubi's chakra was brought up for a reason; that, says Yamato, is the reason this training works out for Naruto.
     
  46. Continuity .

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    You don't acknowledge the difference between using it's chakra and using it's manifestation?

    Summon Gamabunta = Good
    Develop poisonous shroud under Kyuubi's control = Bad
    Turn into mini Kyuubi that can't determine friend or foe = Very bad

    If you can do one without the other, it would be good. Naruto could summon Gamabunta in part 1 without going out of control, because his seal was stronger. His seal, which keeps Kyuubi's control at bay, is weakened. Remember his transforming after fighting Deidara? He is losing contol in emotional states easier than before, and using a lot of chakra will bring him closer to using Kyuubi chakra. Using Kyuubi chakra can lead to Kyuubi's manifestation easier than before, when the seal was stronger. Now that Yamato is there to help in the training, Naruto can use some of this Kyuubi chakra, to allow him to keep these clones present for weeks possibly. He needs the Kyuubi chakra to perform this training in such a short time.

    Remember: If any ninja with a lot of chakra (like Kisame and Naruto) could do this training, it would have been done before and suggested sooner. Since only Naruto has access to possibly the biggest source of chakra in the world, only he can realistically do this training. Even Kisame doesn't have enough, it would seem. The problem with this is that if Naruto uses that chakra, he can go into a tailed transformation, and that's what Yamato is there for, to prevent that. Yamato allows some chakra to leak through, like the seal used to do quite well, and he disallows the supreme overflow that is tailed transformations.
     
  47. Waraji Random Random Random

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    uh is that what i typed? i dont think it is
     
  48. I Я Reckless! shoot 'em dead

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    I think that if he was using the Kyuubi's chakra, the Manga would have made it obvious that he was doing so.Since there is no proof that he's using it, logically we should assume that hes not
     
  49. Descent of the Lion What 0Fear has always been

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    Kyuubi is not in this training...period. Thats why Yamato is struggling constantly to hold him back.
     
  50. I Я Reckless! shoot 'em dead

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    Yea, if Yamato is their, then wouldnt that mean that the chakra is being supressed??Meaning that he has to rely on his own chakra??
     

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